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Old 12-02-2012, 10:02 PM   #1
Slyster
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Arrow Tutorial - What charger? What power supply?

Introduction

There are generally two catagories of chargers. The AC 'plug in the wall' chargers, and chargers that require an external DC power source (12v or higher). The latter being most common. For the most part, the AC 'plug in' chargers are low power and generally can only charge between 50-100W. AC chargers are adequate for micro helis.. and for larger helis if you have a large number of packs like to 'charge the night before'.

For charging larger packs, and for fast field charging, most people go with chargers using external power supplies. These chargers are capable of charging 1000W and more. That equates to 30-40A output even charging 6s lipos.

Power sources

High output chargers can be powered by deep cycles batteries or AC/DC power supplies powered from your home AC or a generator. Most use computer server power supplies which are available from many sources including eBay. For highest charger output, two power supplies can be connected is series for 24v output which most chargers need to reach their full potential. (more info below)

Parallel charging

Many today are using parallel cables to charge multiple packs. This allows 1 to 6 packs (of the same cell count) to be charged at the same time. Parallel boards are also available but I have found that parallel cables (sometimes called 'squids') are easier to hook up especially with larger lipos.

Besides the convenience of charging 2 or more packs at once, parallel cables save additional time as well. Since the charger sees six 6s4000mah packs as one large 6s24000mah pack.. you save around 5 minutes of balancing time per pack.. and therefore charging six packs in parallel would save you around 25 minutes over charging them one at a time.

The great thing about powering a high output charger with a couple of inexpensive deep cycle batteries is that you can get by with only 2 flight packs. Charge one and fly the other... all day long!

Another tip

If you fly micro helis (mcpx, 130x etc) you can power your charger with a larger lipo for portable charging at the field or in the gym (for us facing winter!). I use a 6s5000mah for my 130x and can get more charges than I'd ever use in 1 day.

Be sure to check how many input volts your charger can handle... you may be able to use a 6s pack, but some chargers can't take 24V so you would use a 3s lipo.

Useful links

How to charge using deep cycles
http://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=374446

General lipo and charger information (read if you haven't!)
http://www.tjinguytech.com/charging-how-tos

Lipo basics cheat sheet
http://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=336421

Photo showing a couple of packs hooked to the charger using 'squids' (parallel cables). Notice you need both the main and balance connectors... so each pack is connected twice for balance charging.

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Last edited by Slyster; 12-03-2012 at 10:23 PM..
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Old 12-02-2012, 10:58 PM   #2
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Default Charger Threads - alphabetical order

C
Cellpro10xp http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1478938

H
HYPERION EOS NET, DUO, and DUO2 Chargers http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=960657

I
iCharger 1010B+, 106B+, 208B, 206B, 306B and 3010B
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=839657
iCharger 4010b http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1626690

P
Powerlab 8 http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1176112
Powerlab 6 http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1525834
Powerlab 6 Review http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1641847

Pulsar 3 http://helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=396935

R
RC Logger Charger http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1707883

T
ThunderPower TP-820CD http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1215925

Turnigy Accucell-6 http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=886698
Turnigy Accucell-8 http://helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=237013
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Old 12-02-2012, 11:03 PM   #3
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Default Power Supplies

Server Supplies
Mark Forsyth http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1563369
FeatherMerchant http://feathermerchantrc.com/
ebay - See DIY links below


Hobby Supplies
Junsi 1200 http://www.progressiverc.com/junsi-s...er-supply.html
Meanwell 1000 Watt (adjustable from 20-26.4V)
http://www.progressiverc.com/mean-well-rsp-1000-24-

DIY Links

HP 575 DPS-600pb
Main Thread http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1581061
DC ground removal http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...41&postcount=8

Pinout info from <http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showt...369612&page=38>

the DPS-600pb also has these pins.
Use a 1k ohm pot between pins 3 and 9 to increase voltage above 12v.
Use a 1k ohm pot between pins 5 and 9 to decrease voltage below 12v.
Or use a single 2k-10k pot with the outer legs tied to pins 3 and 5 and the center wiper to pin 9 for voltage adjustment above and below 12v.

<http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...&postcount=586>


the DPS-600pb also has these pins. Use a 1k ohm pot between pins 3 and 9 to adjust voltage.
I've modified a pic by mrforsyth to show how to do this.
Voltage is adjustable up to 13.8v on this supply. OVP starts at 13.82v.
If the PS shuts down at 13.8v with a load then just back it down to 13.7v.
Also, short pin 4 to ground to slow fan speed to a minimum
Pin 11 is the +12v current share pin.
Short pins 6,8 and 10 together to power up.


265Ω = 13.8v
290Ω = 13.7v
330Ω = 13.6v
370Ω = 13.5v

Dell 700W units (model NPS-700AB)
http://www.tjinguytech.com/my-projects/server-ps (left side of the page)

Power on and slow fan speed (required due to noise) pins (from TjinTech and Dale (KiloOne))





Dell 550W units (model AA23300)
http://www.tjinguytech.com/my-projects/server-ps (right side of the page)
Power on pinouts are the same as above. However fan slowing pin outs don't work. The default speed on the 550 is low so they are quiet to begin with.

Ground removal (both Dell units)
http://helifreak.com/album.php?album...ictureid=53912
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Old 12-02-2012, 11:05 PM   #4
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Default Power Supplies - Active Power Factor Correction (APFC)

When running chargers from a generator, or using two high wattage chargers on residential circuits, its important for the power supply to operate as efficiently as possible. Otherwise, the charger output could be significantly reduced. Some supplies include active power factor correction (apfc for short) which can dramatically increase the supply efficienty and boost charger output. Here's how.

With resistive loads, the AC current is in phase with the voltage. With inductive or capacitive loads the AC current is out of phase with the voltage. The result is higher current levels are required to achieve the same wattage at the load. There are two ratings for the load, watts and VA (or voltage amps). Watts is the effective power, whereas VA is the actual power being drawn from the AC source. You can test this with an inexpensive device called a Kill-A-Watt from P3.

APFC intelligently modifies the load so that the AC current is in phase with the voltage. The result is that the wattage being consumed by the load (server supply) is now close to the VA being drawn from the AC source. Typical results achieved are 96% to 99%. Without APFC, typical results are 60% to 74%.

The RSP series (Meanwell) have active PFC as does all the server supplies I've tested. Here's more info.

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Old 12-02-2012, 11:06 PM   #5
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Default A note about charger specs and limits

Chargers are a collection of electronic components each with their own operating specifications, combined in a circuit that has operational limits. Because increasing the rated specifications of any one component increases cost, the manufacture will try balance parts and engineering costs with the market competition. The end result is that every charger will have slightly different operational specifications. When evaluating a charger, consider that every charger has three major maximum limits. There are minor limits that can come into play when fully evaluating a charger. But the top specifications to consider are:

Output wattage - Maximum wattage the charger can deliver regardless of all other factors. This can be reduced by internal temperature sensors.

Output current - Maximum output current the charger is allowed to deliver to the packs regardless of pack voltage, input voltage or input current.

Input current - Maximum current that the charger is allowed to pull regardless of input voltage.

Though these specifications are interrelated, each specification varies from charger to charger. The resulting performance of any given charger cannot be fully evaluated by looking at any single number. This is not a case of the manufacture attempting to deceive. But rather a byproduct of how chargers are designed and built.

Likewise, there are may different charging scenarios, from small 1s packs to parallel charging six 6s 5000 at a time. There are many different ways to power a charger from a single lead acid (Pb) battery to large AC driven power supplies. It is the manufacture's job to build and sell products which competitively meet a number of different charging scenarios. It is the consumer's job to evaluate the charger's specifications and determine which charger best meets their current and future charging scenarios.

Some changes to a specific charging specific scenario can be made to accommodate the limit allowing the charger to increase its output before hitting another limit. For example, increasing the input voltage reduces the input current for the same wattage. If the charger is hitting an input current limit, moving from 12v to 24v can double the charger's output.
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Old 12-02-2012, 11:07 PM   #6
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Default Charger Case Threads

Looking for some examples of charging cases? These three threads show some amazing creativity and workmanship. This is great place to get ideas and see some of the great work being done by fellow hobbyist.

http://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=306148
http://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=331196
http://rc.runryder.com/helicopter/t618155p1/
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1493834
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Old 12-02-2012, 11:09 PM   #7
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Default Fused or Unfused Parallel cables and boards

There parallel boards and parallel cables. Boards are tidy and compact but can be hard to use if your pack's balance leads are short. Cables can be bulky an awkward but easier to use for packs with short cables. Cables are currently not available with fuses. Parallel boards are available with or without fuses.

These boards do cost more. But there is very good reasons. When parallel charging its very easy for a short to occur which results in burned wires, damaged batterys, harm to oneself and property. Below are some examples of this.


Traces Burned
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1620728

Traces Burned Twice
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1634850

Three Reports of Burned traces
http://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=383073

Balance wire burned
http://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=424281

Wire Burned
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1670469

Balance Wires Shorted
http://helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=430573

Charge Lead plugged in backwards
http://helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=436224

Balance wires burned
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1743871

Paraboard burned
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1773045

Batteries balance wires burned using parallel board.
http://helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=472663

Burned traces - Connector inserted backwards
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showp...&postcount=423
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Old 12-02-2012, 11:10 PM   #8
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Default Under purchasing chargers

Especially when first starting out or transitioning from kit chargers, there may be a tendancy to under purchase the charger. This is common and frequently ends up repurchasing a larger charger not long after the first charger. With rare exception, most everyone in this hobby continues adding models to thier fleet. Typically increasing in size. A good charger will outlast your current fleet and then some.

One can start seeing the benefits of a larger charger with a model as small as a 450. With 12v power supply a 1000 watt charger, one can parallel charge six batteries at 3c (about 15-20 minutes to have 6 packs ready). A smaller charger many only be able to charge one 450 pack at 2c (or roughly 2 and half hours for 6 packs).

Below are some examples of those that under purchased thier charger setup.

Quattro not enough power
http://helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=436115

just went from a 50w to this thing and its so much nicer to have a pack ready in 20 minutes
http://helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=432684

2 hrs for a 10 min flight seems a little painful
http://helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=417199

I can't charge any higher than 2.2amp. No matter what I set the charger to it doesn't go any higher.
http://helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=424933

I want to get a nicer charger, so I don't have to wait forever.
http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1676756

How to increase charge current on Thunder AC6 charger (6s packs charge only at 2amps)
http://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=438509

Hitec x4 - Why does my charger only charge at 2.2 amps when its set to 6 amps?
http://helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=448959
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Old 12-03-2012, 07:41 AM   #9
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Generators.

Many choose generators for charging in the field. There are many popular brandes of generators. I use an RV generator (check RV stores too!) since they must be quiet (campgrounds and state parks) and have enough juice for the A/C so they are great for funflys. Remember you still need external power supplies with generators as they put out 110VAC.

Some better related generator links

General Generator information
http://www.generatorjoe.net/page.asp?id=20

Champion generators
http://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=433331

Honda generators
http://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=448041

Portable Generator Question
http://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=417140

Field charging generator
http://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=416533

Boliy generators (Popular in the RV world)
http://www.boliyguy.com/

Need a generator
http://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=411424

How to charge at the field with a generator
http://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=410429
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Old 12-03-2012, 08:02 AM   #10
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DIY Power Supply

Mentioned above in passing, the Dell 6650 is already isolated and has variable speed fans. This makes it an easier DIY mod, two hooked together will give you 72 amps and 24 volts, enough for the most demanding power needs.

http://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=331196

Another Charger (same as the iCharger 106B)
http://www.readyheli.com/Voltz-101K-...r_p_37877.html
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Old 12-03-2012, 08:15 AM   #11
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Here is a fused parallel board

http://epbuddy.com/index.php?main_pa...roducts_id=339
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Old 12-25-2012, 04:49 PM   #12
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Here is my setup in the truck. I field charge only these days.. using dual deep cycles... saves time and wear on the lipos. Charges packs in 12 minutes and enough juice to fly all day long.

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Old 12-25-2012, 10:18 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Slyster View Post
Here is my setup in the truck. I field charge only these days.. using dual deep cycles... saves time and wear on the lipos. Charges packs in 12 minutes and enough juice to fly all day long.
Does the charger typically charge up the deep cycles? And if so, how long does it usually take?
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Old 12-25-2012, 10:22 PM   #14
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You certainly can charge your deep cycles with your charger when you get home. LImit the charging to 10A per battery. It takes 6-8 hours.

I myself use a dedicated noco Gens 2 deep cycle charger ($140).. one you might find in a bass boat... just for the ease of passing an orange extension cord through my window when I get home.
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Old 01-02-2013, 05:05 PM   #15
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Subcribed
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Old 02-16-2013, 11:37 AM   #16
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Parallel cables for small models

mCPX (1s original model)
Squid - Unfused http://www.progressiverc.com/paralle...-2-charge.html
Parallel board - Fused http://epbuddy.com/index.php?main_pa...roducts_id=347

130x (2s)
Squid - Unfused http://www.progressiverc.com/paralle...beast-umx.html
Parallel Board - Fused
http://epbuddy.com/index.php?main_pa...roducts_id=348
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Old 02-16-2013, 03:09 PM   #17
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I quoted this from another thread... good stuff to have in the sticky.

From RedOctoby

]Sounds like you're on the right track. I bought an iCharger 106B+ when I had my mCP X. 250W was enormous. Now that I have my 450, 10A and 250W suddenly got a lot smaller.

If the budget will allow for the 306B, it's a much more future-proof choice than the 106B+ or the 206B. More expensive, yes, but only about $40 more than the 206B, and 3X the power.

Not to complicate things, but take a close look at the FMA Powerlab PL6 as well. Basically the same price as the 306B, but it sounds more flexible, and can go up to a 40A output, vs 30A for the 306B. The Powerlabs are supposed to be outstanding chargers.

For cables, ProgressiveRC carries a range of parallel charging cables. Not having any of the helis you mentioned, I don't want to make specific cable suggestions, and accidentally pick the wrong one. I *think* the mCP X BL uses the same plugs as the 130X? Progressive sells a cable for that.

http://www.progressiverc.com/adapter...arallel-charge

For power supplies, this one's tough. You don't want to solder stuff, no worries. Just, be aware that you can buy something like a DPS-600PB server power supply off eBay for <$15 shipped, solder on a few wires (following instructions people have put online), and be in business. That will get you 12V, 47A, 575W for maybe $20.

You can buy that same power supply here, already modified for our use, for $65 plus shipping, but it's ready to plug in.

http://www.solidhobby.com/index.php?...t&product_id=3

There are other sources for already-modified supplies as well. Even buying a server supply already modified will still be cheaper than an equivalent-wattage commercial, hobby supply. The server ones are likely higher quality, as well (meant to run 24/7/365).

With a >300W charger, you won't get the full output with 12V. You need a 24V supply to really max out the charger. But you could get a 12V supply for now, that will hold you through a 450. You could go to a 24V supply later. I can add a second DPS-600PB, for instance, modifying a few more things, to give myself 24V, for another $15.

Consider putting more money into the charger than the power supply. You won't be stressing the PS at all for quite a while (or the charger, to be honest). But buying a better charger will serve you nicely when you need that power in the future. I ran my 106B+ off a $10 generic 15V/6A/90W laptop power supply for a season, since the 90W that it offered was plenty for my mCP X needs. This season I bought a server supply, for 450 use, once the 90W held me back. But no need to go big on the PS right away.

progressiverc.com and epbuddy.com are great sources for this stuff. I believe epbuddy includes a parallel board (which you'd use for larger 450 batteries) when you buy the larger chargers. progressiverc does not. I bought my iCharger from progressiverc, they were great, excellent service. Both stores have great reputations.
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Old 03-29-2013, 11:51 AM   #18
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Default eFuel 60a Power Supply

The eFuel 60a power supply is growing in popularity. However, there are a few things to be aware of regarding this supply.

It does not have active power factor correction. This can be a significant issue when running from a generator or running from US residential wiring at 120v AC. It has been known to trip breakers without being powered on and does not deliver its full wattage rating before shutting down.
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Old 03-29-2013, 12:23 PM   #19
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Default Tutorial - What charger? What power supply?

I've been running the Junsi S1200. I've done up to 40 amps (20 amps per side, simultaneously) on my iCharger 4010 duo via my basic 120v home wall outlet... Hasn't skipped a beat. Power supply has been up to the task and the charger can handle more than the power supply can deliver.

Great combo!
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Old 05-11-2013, 12:50 PM   #20
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Footnote: The APFC videos in post #4 were created by the RR user spdntckt. I forgot to add that into the post and now cannot edit the post.
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