Warp 360 very pitch sensitive

[hrefab]

I have just sorted out 90% of my Warp 360 with the Skookum 540 (Thanks Anthony1). The only real remaining problem that I have is that the heli is VERY sensitive to pitch changes. I have tried a number of different pitch curves, lowered my total Pitch to +11° and -7° (I don't do 3d so I don't really need all that much negative). She lifts off nicely, but even slight stick inputs make her very jumpy. i'm wondering if this is a characteristic of the heli or if I am maybe missing something in my setup.

My Numbers are as follows
NORMAL
23-33-50-65-86

Idle Up 1
-100, -50, 0, 50, 100
(But I don't fly in Idleup1 anyway.)


Just seems that compared to all my other helis, this one really likes to jump up from 3/4 stick up.

My Pitch numbers are

-7° at low stick, 0° at mid stick and -11° at high stick

Any other info you might need, just let me know.

Thanks

[velocity90]

It's because of the rigid head. niceee

Put it back at 12 and lower the rpm. 1800-2200 rpm

[hrefab]

Will give it a try and get back with report. Thanks!

[BaconRaygun]

I don't find the Warp to be any more pitch sensitive than any other 450 that I have flown or owned.


I think your problem is mechanical setup. You should not be getting 11 degrees of pitch at 85% pitch input. My heli is set up with + - 12 degrees of pitch, at 85% I probably have around 8 or 9 degrees of pitch.

Can you post a picture showing your cyclic servo links? Curious to see how far out the ball-studs are on the servo horns.

It could even be an FBL setting, but I don't know Skookum unit so I cant comment on this with any certainty.

Also, what is your headspeed?
Cant agree with velocity90 here, 1800-2200 is too slow for a beginner with a heli like this, IMO best beginner headspeed range for this heli is around 2600-2800.

[hrefab]

Thank you BRG. I have 20+ helis from tiny MCPX'.s to Trex 700. None of my other 450's fly like this, nor do my 500, 550, 600 or 700. Even my Trex 250 is more stable (pitch wise). And As a comparison, my Atom 500 doesn't fly like this either. Perhaps it IS my mechanical setup, but it's built exactly as the manual called for.I'll post photos when I get back to the shop.

[anthony1]

I have +- 12 degrees on my warp with the sk540 and its really smooth on the collective, in fact I am trying to make it a little more aggressive for tic tocs, I really like the way it flies so imho I think its a setup issue, what servos are you using ?

[anthony1]

here's most of my setup tabs, apart from 25% expo on aileron and elevator this is everything, my pitch curves are 0-25-50-75-100 on all 3 iu's, and throttle is governed, servo ball distance is 16 mm and around 9mm for the tail , for me this flies very sedately if I need it too but some pop if I want it, I am just starting to retune it for faster responses. see how it compares
Anthony

[hrefab]

Servos are MKS DS92A on Cyclics and DS95i on the tail.

I switched up the pitch numbers and now have +12/-10 so we can eliminate that from the mix. Easy enough to deal with on that end.

My expo is at -40 ( I always set expo high on a new model so that I can adjust based on how it flies. I usually run between -25 and -30 (remember Futaba is negative) once I have things sorted out.)


Pitch curve is -100, -50, 0, +50, _100

That translates into -10°, -6°, 0°. -8°, -12°

Throttle curve is 0,25,50,75,100

Have to go look at the other numbers.

In the Skookum, my Aileron and Elevator cyclic (Swash Mixing) are at 45 while my Collective Pitch is at 35

Phase trim is 0

[hrefab]

Here is better. took me a minute to get my jpgs in order.

[anthony1]

only a couple of differences that I can see .in the swash menu it seems like your mix% are a little low, don't know if it makes a difference , but I put my servo movement to 100 in the swash servo tab and increased the mix %, I think its something to do with resolution, that could be causing the jumpy collective , and also I would try 1% deadband on the elevator and aileron as this can also give sudden acceleration around centre stick .
for the throttle curve I would try 0-40-70-85-100 for normal and 100-95-90-95-100 for iu1 personally I much prefer using the governor for the throttle its much more consistent
Anthony

[RontaryUS]

Op, i looked at your sk setup screenshots, few things:

1/ gov is on with very low headspeeds and gear ratio is wrong
>> Do you have a governor sensor? Did you setup the governor with the SK wizard?

2/ your servo centering on the swash servo is 0 for all 3, this is unlikely.
>>Did you run the swash setup and followed it correctly?

3/ your swash mixes at 45 are unusual. On the wrap it is more on the high side i.e close to 60. This and the pitch you indicate is in favor of a too high mechanical gain and/or setup issue.
>>Did you place the balls as per manual on the cyclic servo arms?

From those questions, we should be able to help you more...

[Ah Clem]

I have two Warps, one with a BeastX and one with a Robird. Both have stock motors, JR servos, Castle ESC, KBDD main and tail blades. Both have +/-12 degrees of pitch and run throttle curves and mixing as opposed to a governor.

Neither has the issue that you describe. I have no background with the FBL unit that you are using, so I apologize, but cannot help there.

Have you considered an "S" shaped pitch curve that is slightly flatter around zero degrees of pitch?

I have seen this work with other machines.

[hrefab]

Anthony1; Changing my throttle curves to your suggestion ( I did try several different curves, all had the same effect. Your suggested curve is a little more straighforward than my previous settings) Changing deadband as well. we'll see how this works.

RontaryUS;

Turned off gov. Had not flown with that setting. Turned it on last night. Easier to eliminate that from the mix. Can fiddle with Governors later.

Servo centering is correct at 0. Servo arms are at 90° with 0 adjustment. I took great pains to set up the swash properly. 0° at mid stick, servo arms 90°

Bumped the swash mixes up to 60, adjusted the collective to 39 to bring the pitch numbers all into line.

The heli is so close, I"m confident that further tweaking with resolve any issues. If not, I'll shoot a video and perhaps we can analyze that.

They are calling for heavy rain tomorrow but we will see what I can do to get this in the air, if even for a few minutes.

All this help is phenomenal and very much appreciated.

I have really taken to this Warp 360 (as well as the ATOM 500). They are unusually well made helis. I like the spartan construction and low part count. Just have to get this one smoothed out.

[hrefab]

Here is a pic of the servo arms at mid stick. Disregard any parallax in the photo, they are at exactly 90°

[anthony1]

did you drop the amount of throw you have from 125%( default) to 100% in the swash servo tab?

[GravityJunkie]

Makes sure all your linkages are smooth. Every stock end I've used on the warp has been tight.

[RontaryUS]

Hrefab, you are getting on the right path. Let us know how further testing goes.

[hrefab]

Anthony1: No, I left it at 125 so that I wouldn't have to mechanically adjust the links. The links are set as per the manual (length wise) so As long as I wasn't stalling out the servos I figured I'd leave that setting alone.

GravityJunkie: I know what you mean. The links on my ATOM 500 were so tight they didn't really want to move. Even the manual stated that they needed to be sized because they wouldn't loosen up. I have the COMPASS ball link sizer and used that (very carefully!) to set up the links.)

It's pouring rain here now, so I'm hoping for a break sometime today to give these setting a try.

[anthony1]

the 125% adjusts the amount of throw of the servo so you would not have to re centre them but you might have to increase the swash % to get the 12 degrees of pitch, but right now I think you are over driving your servos, I could be wrong though

[hrefab]

I thought about it and you're right. I know that the servos weren't stalling, but that is different from overdriving them. I lowered the percentages to 100% across the board and only had to increase the collective percentages to 46 to get back all the travel that I had originally.

I have to say that making changes with the Skookum Software is very easy. The little help balloons that pop up on settings are informative, but nothing can replace 'talking' to the people who are already using it.

My confidence with this setup is growing just from the interaction of this forum. I may have to fly this in the warehouse if it doesn't stop raining