check out this video (brown out problem?) IT IS STATIC!

[Cash Killer]

http://www.physlink.com/Education/AskExperts/ae568.cfm
The way an aircraft tries to dissipate these step leaders is through the use of something called a "static wick". A static wick is a piece of metal connected electrically to the frame of the aircraft, with one or two spikes or needles on the end. It is housed in a fiberglass rod to insulate it from the airplane. Because the spikes concentrate the electric charge around them, and they are connected to the airframe, they allow the airplane to dissipate any static electricity it may build up out into the air. Also - if lightning DOES strike the plane, the chances are that the electricity will go through the dissipator and not through the airplane. You can see pictures of these dissipators on the 737 webpage below.


I found this it, might help.

[ChasHeliCop]

Ok, here it is..... the 450 (correction I said 600 in the video, it was the 500)

450 ESD compare to 500 (1 min 32 sec)

[Justin911]

awesome vids.. so if its the main gear. how do we solve that problem?

[ChasHeliCop]

Originally Posted by rdlohr

Can you take the belt off the front pulley and try it. Maybe the nylon gears are just conducting the ESD but not generating it.

Rick, if you noticed in the first video, i started out on the tail boom. There was nothing there, but as soon as i got to the gears, it lit up.....

Now, just a theory at this point, but it appears the 450 isolates the ESD looking at the gears and configuration, the 450 uses gears made of the same material in the reduction gear and the drive gear. It appears the 500 has gears made from two different materials.

Also, the configuration of the tail drive systems are slightly different. One the 450 the drive pulley sits on the top of the shaft, separated from the drive gear by a bearing in a bearing block. On the 500 the drive gear and drive pulley are in closer proximity next to each other.

Possibly changing the material of the tail drive gear would help.... I don't know.

[chichiuno]

Originally Posted by ChasHeliCop

the 450 uses gears made of the same material in the reduction gear and the drive gear. It appears the 500 has gears made from two different materials.

Good piont. The two different materials is a key ingredient in the Vander thingy.
Did you have lockout problems? If you shut the lights do you see any ESD?

[dieselracer]

Originally Posted by ChasHeliCop

Rick, if you noticed in the first video, i started out on the tail boom. There was nothing there, but as soon as i got to the gears, it lit up.....

Now, just a theory at this point, but it appears the 450 isolates the ESD looking at the gears and configuration, the 450 uses gears made of the same material in the reduction gear and the drive gear. It appears the 500 has gears made from two different materials.

Also, the configuration of the tail drive systems are slightly different. One the 450 the drive pulley sits on the top of the shaft, separated from the drive gear by a bearing in a bearing block. On the 500 the drive gear and drive pulley are in closer proximity next to each other.

Possibly changing the material of the tail drive gear would help.... I don't know.

Would grounding the main shaft to the frame, motor, boom, esc etc.. Help?

[bobby619]

Would having the metal bearing blocks and grounding the motor mount ground the main shaft?

[Jason Bell]

450..reason being no static in the boom area...metal tail case/bearing blocks.
500....no metal.. so its not grounded.

As to why our 450s are not affected by this, is because we mount the rx's far enough away from the "static" that its prolly not affected.

But with the 500, the rx is close to static everywhere, boom and main gear.

I asked Chase if he could test again in the areas of the rx tray, and the lower tray as well(common rx placements)... and see what "livewire" picks up.

[ChasHeliCop]

I am thinking that replacing the tail drive gear possibly with a metal gear may solve the problem. I have to figure out what actually stops the charge on the 450 first.

[ChasHeliCop]

That's why I located my receiver on the bottom tray..... see thread, Rick Lohr is going to be making these modified Rx trays that don't flex like the stock ones to mount the gyro on.

https://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=60954

[Justin911]

Originally Posted by torkboy

450..reason being no static in the boom area...metal tail case/bearing blocks.
500....no metal.. so its not grounded.

As to why our 450s are not affected by this, is because we mount the rx's far enough away from the "static" that its prolly not affected.

But with the 500, the rx is close to static everywhere, boom and main gear.

I asked Chase if he could test again in the areas of the rx tray, and the lower tray as well(common rx placements)... and see what "livewire" picks up.

I would also like to see that. I am curious. where the receiver sits on the frame, it could be in side a static bubble that can get cut out when it because charged. I wonder if placing the receiver on the bottom tray and not the receiver mount could solve that problem and get it farther away from the main gear static.

[bobby619]

Originally Posted by torkboy

450..reason being no static in the boom area...metal tail case/bearing blocks.
500....no metal.. so its not grounded.

As to why our 450s are not affected by this, is because we mount the rx's far enough away from the "static" that its prolly not affected.

But with the 500, the rx is close to static everywhere, boom and main gear.

I asked Chase if he could test again in the areas of the rx tray, and the lower tray as well(common rx placements)... and see what "livewire" picks up.

So would the boom have static on a Trex 450s? It has a plastic boom block.

[Jason Bell]

Originally Posted by bobby619

So would the boom have static on a Trex 450s? It has a plastic boom block.

Chas will be finding out what fixes the static, whether it is a metal tail pulley, metal bearing blocks, or a metal boom block. He believes it is a pulley, which I believe too, as it grounds the belt(the problem) to metal.

[ChasHeliCop]

Rx placement on my 500 with a modified Rx tray for the gyro.

see thread for mod
https://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=60954

[ChasHeliCop]

Originally Posted by bobby619

So would the boom have static on a Trex 450s? It has a plastic boom block.

i have a 450 V2 it has an aluminum anodized boom block and bearing blocks. Also, one other observation i made, and i could be wrong, but it appears the boom block on the 500 may be made of a different material than the 600. It almost appears like there is "possibly" carbon fiber in the boom block. That's totally a guess !

[ChasHeliCop]

Originally Posted by chichiuno

Good piont. The two different materials is a key ingredient in the Vander thingy.
Did you have lockout problems? If you shut the lights do you see any ESD?

I had a "brownout" before I relocated my gyro and Rx.... I haven't tried running it up with the lights out. Might do that tomorrow too.

[Justin911]

how has the new receiver mount worked for you? any problems since you have moved it?

[ChasHeliCop]

I haven't had any problems since, but that's no guarantee, i think Fireup had his Rx down there and had a lock out. Any way you look at it, taking the gyro off the boom block and the Rx on the bottom tray puts it further away from the ESD.

[Jason Bell]

Originally Posted by ChasHeliCop

I haven't had any problems since, but that's no guarantee, i think Fireup had his Rx down there and had a lock out. Any way you look at it, taking the gyro off the boom block and the Rx on the bottom tray puts it further away from the ESD.

Unless you have a static shield(metal plate supplied) for it, then it should be fine. At least I think that would block it?

[Justin911]

ok thats good to know. i am gonna mount my RX on the bottom tray tomorrow and give it a shot... I have my gyro mounted on the boom block for now and I may leave it there. we'll see

Jason. where would you put that metal tray?