START HERE |
|
Register | FAQ | PM | Events | Groups | Blogs | Calendar | Mark Forums Read |
Unregistered
|
300X Blade 300X Helicopters Information and Help |
|
LinkBack | Thread Tools | Display Modes |
07-17-2014, 03:44 AM | #1061 (permalink) | ||
Registered Users
|
Quote:
A motor is not like a light bulb which draws constant power depending on input voltage, but draws increasingly more power when motor speed drops from idle (no-load max possible powered speed) due to load. How much more current (thus power) draws due to rpm drop from load hugely depends on the motor power rating, which is mostly determined by copper fill, which in turn is mostly determined by stator dimensions (e.g. 2215 means stator is 22mm in diameter and 15mm in height). Obviously, the bigger the stator dimensions the bigger the possible copper fill, assuming the windings are not badly done to use just half the available space. That's exactly why all good motors mention their stator dimensions, e.g. Scorpion/Hyperion 2213, Lynx 2214, Typhoon 2215. So then theoretically everyone should choose the highest power possible motor to replace governor? Not that easy. The problem with high power motor is not just extra weight but also internal resistance. As motor speed drops from max possible powered speed, internal resistance decreases (which is what triggers to draw more current and thus power). However, when IR drops to the point close to IR of the battery/ESC/etc., you get lost of power. Imagine the motor is connected to the output of a voltage divider circuit and get fraction of the battery voltage. This is where governor stands out. With it, you can get away with a lower power motor to prevent comparable IR to the battery and rest of the system IRs but OTOH the governor gives you the feel of a high power motor of its increasing current/power draw under load. Now here is why 0 pitch HS means nothing. Well, it means something. It means whether you gear your particular motor within reasonable HS, but it shows nothing about the motor's possible performance which is reflected by its power like mentioned above. Here are some real-world numbers for reference. With an efficient motor like the Hyperion 2213-3585, efficient X2-spec blades, it takes just 90W to maintain 3600rpm HS at 0 pitch. A really strong 3S motor for the 130X can probably do max 100W. So if I gear it properly I can run that 130X motor on my 300X to get 3600rpm HS at 0 pitch but you know that it's going to drop HS crazy as soon as I increase pitch from 0 so again 3600rpm HS at 0 pitch means nothing. Quote:
__________________
mCPx'es/130X/3D-foamie: ugly mods 300X: fast beater/trainer, Protos stretched: trainer but can also go fast FPV250 5.8G, nQx FPV, Oh also Trex 450DFC Last edited by DoubleCH; 07-17-2014 at 05:14 AM.. |
||
Sponsored Links | |||
Advertisement |
|
07-17-2014, 07:05 AM | #1062 (permalink) |
Registered Users
Join Date: Jul 2012
|
I'm clueless on how some of this stuff works and all I can comment on is what actually performs better; but why it performs better is for gurus like you to figure out.
I haven't tried 12Khz yet on fixed end points, I was simply suggesting it might be worth trying for lower throttle curves (I've tried 12Khz, but only when running a governed setup). I was flying this at 8Khz, and the Typhoon didn't seem to perform well until I reached 85% throttle as you see in my video. At 70%, 75%, and 80% throttle, it seemed to bog easily, or at least it couldn't keep up with the headspeed changes (I'm obviously aware and expecting the performance decrease at lower headspeeds). Based on the info in your post, this "sluggishness" is probably more attributable to the internal resistance of the motor, and becomes more apparent at lower power curves when there's less current draw. Either way, the Typhoon is nice and smooth at 8Khz and 85% throttle. I'm going to give 100% throttle a try next time, which should top 4000RPM (Mr. Mel's says 4300RPM but I doubt it'll reach that even at the beginning of the flight). I'll eventually be switching back to gov. store, since the fixed end points is just a test for the heck of it. Anywho, as always, thanks for the information.
__________________
|
07-17-2014, 02:29 PM | #1063 (permalink) | ||
Registered Users
|
Quote:
Quote:
__________________
mCPx'es/130X/3D-foamie: ugly mods 300X: fast beater/trainer, Protos stretched: trainer but can also go fast FPV250 5.8G, nQx FPV, Oh also Trex 450DFC |
||
07-27-2014, 11:12 AM | #1064 (permalink) |
Registered Users
Join Date: Sep 2013
|
Hyperion Replacement
Late to the game here, but is there a Hyperion replacement for the 2213-3585. I noticed they're no longer available and have been discountinued.
|
07-27-2014, 11:43 AM | #1065 (permalink) |
The Airetic
Join Date: Nov 2012
|
Not that I have seen, and I've looked. Bummer huh?
__________________
Free Agent....With standalone opinions. |
07-27-2014, 08:47 PM | #1066 (permalink) |
Registered Users
Join Date: Dec 2013
|
As mentioned earlier somewhere in this thread, someone said that Hyperion is made by scorpion, so the HK 2213-14 is essentially the same, but much pricier
|
07-30-2014, 08:09 AM | #1067 (permalink) |
Registered Users
Thread Starter
|
But well worth it IMO
__________________
Micro: OMP Hobby M1 Medium: Blade 330X 6S, SAB Goblin 380 Big: SAB Goblin 500 Radio: Spektrum DX8 Gen 1 |
07-30-2014, 09:27 AM | #1068 (permalink) | ||
Registered Users
Join Date: Dec 2013
|
Oh yes for sure, I'm currently waiting on my LHS to get it in! It is SO much quieter compared to other motors:
|
||
07-30-2014, 09:48 AM | #1069 (permalink) | |
HF Support
Join Date: Feb 2013
|
Quote:
__________________
Gaui X5F 6S (VBar), Lynx 450X-L 6S (Ikon), Lynx 300X-L 4S (Ikon), Blade 180CFX 3S (Ikon) Lumenier QAV400 4S (Vector), Lumenier QAV250 3S (Naze32/CleanFlight), CYE Stingray 500 4S (TG Multi) AMA Member, HCAM Member |
|
07-31-2014, 03:16 AM | #1070 (permalink) |
Registered Users
Thread Starter
|
The kit motor for the Gaui X2 is a Scorpion motor as well (without Scorpion label)
__________________
Micro: OMP Hobby M1 Medium: Blade 330X 6S, SAB Goblin 380 Big: SAB Goblin 500 Radio: Spektrum DX8 Gen 1 |
07-31-2014, 09:31 AM | #1071 (permalink) | |
HF Support
Join Date: Feb 2013
|
Quote:
Edit: I asked around and the servos apparently come from these guys... http://www.sjproporc.com/
__________________
Gaui X5F 6S (VBar), Lynx 450X-L 6S (Ikon), Lynx 300X-L 4S (Ikon), Blade 180CFX 3S (Ikon) Lumenier QAV400 4S (Vector), Lumenier QAV250 3S (Naze32/CleanFlight), CYE Stingray 500 4S (TG Multi) AMA Member, HCAM Member Last edited by Nelsonisms; 07-31-2014 at 07:42 PM.. |
|
08-01-2014, 03:29 AM | #1072 (permalink) |
Registered Users
Thread Starter
|
Yes sir And the 22A ESC turned out to be a Turnigy Plush, so it can actually be flashed with BL Heli >> you get a governor
__________________
Micro: OMP Hobby M1 Medium: Blade 330X 6S, SAB Goblin 380 Big: SAB Goblin 500 Radio: Spektrum DX8 Gen 1 |
08-07-2014, 03:55 AM | #1073 (permalink) |
Registered Users
Join Date: Nov 2013
|
Uriah suggested that I should get the Typhoon when I was scouting for a new motor, been quite impressed on how it performs...
Was surfing HF and found this: https://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=185074 Align 450M (3500kV) with 13T pinion 0 deg pitch 100% throttle: 3280rpm Hover 100% throttle: 3150rpm @ 15.5A Climb-outs 100% throttle: 2880rpm @ 34A (37A peak) Max power: 408W Ave. power: 156W Ave amps: 13.7A Turnigy Typhoon 2215H (3550kV) with 12T pinion 0 deg pitch 100% throttle: 3250rpm Hover 100% throttle: 3200rpm @ 16A Climb-outs 100% throttle: 2900rpm @ 33A (35A peak) Max power: 395W Ave. power: 159W Ave amps: 14A Not bad for $15...
__________________
Oxy 285 (6s) (AR7200BX, HKII 2216-16, Koby40) T-REX 450L (6s) (VX1e, HK 2520-1880, HW50v3), Goblin 570 (12s) (VX1n, HKIII 4025-550, Jive80+HV) Lynx Team Pilot / Oxy Field Rep |
08-07-2014, 07:16 AM | #1074 (permalink) |
Registered Users
Join Date: Jul 2012
|
Buddy of mine had exactly this Typhoon on his 300X.
after less then 10 flights it went into self-destruction mode (the bearings) - it developed an ennormous play and the heli started to make this funny humming sound and to shake around like hell. Luckily he managed to touch down softly - so the infamous RROD did not happen. He now flies a scorpion. So my 2c: "not bad for 15$, but not good either"
__________________
Active: 130X / 300 CFX /KDS 550 V2 / 350QX / lots of foamies / DX8 / DX6i Retired: mSRX / 120SR / 300X / B-SR / HK450V2 DFC / mCPX (all versions) |
08-07-2014, 08:06 AM | #1075 (permalink) | |
Registered Users
Join Date: Nov 2013
|
Quote:
__________________
Oxy 285 (6s) (AR7200BX, HKII 2216-16, Koby40) T-REX 450L (6s) (VX1e, HK 2520-1880, HW50v3), Goblin 570 (12s) (VX1n, HKIII 4025-550, Jive80+HV) Lynx Team Pilot / Oxy Field Rep |
|
08-07-2014, 09:37 AM | #1076 (permalink) |
Registered Users
Join Date: Jul 2012
|
interesting - maybe my buddy picked the one bad out of a thousand good ones.
...can happen with any manufacturer of course.
__________________
Active: 130X / 300 CFX /KDS 550 V2 / 350QX / lots of foamies / DX8 / DX6i Retired: mSRX / 120SR / 300X / B-SR / HK450V2 DFC / mCPX (all versions) |
08-07-2014, 11:08 AM | #1077 (permalink) |
Registered Users
Join Date: Jul 2012
|
I'm running Typhoon 2215Hs on both of my souped up 300Xs. The one is running a 4s configuration and the other is running a standard 3s configuration. The one running on 3s has over 350 flights on it without issue. The one running 4s has over 40 flights on it without issue. Maybe your buddy didn't take the time to make sure the shaft collar's set screw had thread locker on it from the factory? I had to add thread locker to one of mine. A loose collar can not only destroy the motor, but can also cause premature bearing failure...
My other two 300Xs are running Parkfly P2632 motors.
__________________
|
08-18-2014, 05:02 AM | #1078 (permalink) |
Registered Users
Thread Starter
|
used 2213-14 on FleaBay
__________________
Micro: OMP Hobby M1 Medium: Blade 330X 6S, SAB Goblin 380 Big: SAB Goblin 500 Radio: Spektrum DX8 Gen 1 |
09-20-2014, 10:07 AM | #1079 (permalink) |
Registered Users
Join Date: Jan 2009
|
After using the Parkfly 2362 for around 100 fun if somewhat underpowered flights I decided to go for the Hyperion 2213 3585 motor.
Still available from this site but pricey http://robotbirds.co.uk/catalog/prod...oducts_id=4908 My 300x is running the standard plastic head. Would the plastic head be ok with the extra power if just doing sport flying?
__________________
Trex450, Gaui X3 X5 Taranis x9d plus |
09-20-2014, 12:57 PM | #1080 (permalink) |
Registered Users
|
I run plastic head all my 2000+ flights no problem many with Hyperion 2213-3585, some with Lynx EOX motor.
__________________
mCPx'es/130X/3D-foamie: ugly mods 300X: fast beater/trainer, Protos stretched: trainer but can also go fast FPV250 5.8G, nQx FPV, Oh also Trex 450DFC |
Thread Tools | |
Display Modes | |
|
|