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Electric Motors Winding and Repair Electric Motors Winding and Repair Discussion |
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02-07-2012, 02:45 PM | #1 (permalink) |
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700-MX Winding Project
Has one of you guys already rewound a Align MX-700?
The motor is very cheap. With some research you get 'em new for 100-130 USD. Would be a perfect candidate, since the stator is powdercoated and could save you from fiddling with the insulation paper. I know, that Stolla is also interested. Any thoughts on this or interest?
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Kind Regards ZT - TDR, No problem can be solved from the same level of consciousness that created it.(AE) Last edited by ZuvieleTeile; 02-09-2012 at 08:22 AM.. |
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02-07-2012, 09:21 PM | #2 (permalink) |
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im waiting on Klaus for some details, actually had one for rewinds but it works so well in the vibe e8 as is I'm not gonna bother, but for the bigger birds it will be similar in power to a rewind pyro, plus it has 8mm shaft and as you mentioned cheap and powder coated ,a real good candidate for sure
I will post some rewind data soon on the 4535 and pyro as well as an easy way to remove stators without damaging them, in short you use the mounting holes 4 bolts and spacers to push the stator out, helps to heat it up in oven to get glue soft |
02-08-2012, 07:02 AM | #3 (permalink) |
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tuning of Align 700MX just has been done by torro:
http://www.tuning.powerditto.de/12N10PAlign700MX.html |
02-08-2012, 08:49 AM | #4 (permalink) |
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Thanks for that and visiting us here, really appreciated! Saw your other posts as well, regarding tools I've seen those on power croco but can't find something similar, where to get?
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02-08-2012, 12:27 PM | #5 (permalink) |
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I am sure I saw Knipex tools at Sears last week.
Awefully expensive, but worth it. I have some Knipex C-Clip tools myself Rest in the tool thread.
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Kind Regards ZT - TDR, No problem can be solved from the same level of consciousness that created it.(AE) Last edited by ZuvieleTeile; 02-08-2012 at 12:29 PM.. Reason: wrong thread |
02-08-2012, 02:21 PM | #6 (permalink) |
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any advantage to rewinding a Align 600MX 9N6P motor ?
there more readily available and may be a cheaper alternative to do a first time PowerCroco winding. Most folks have these motors kicking around. noticed 600MX is pressed fit and the stator has no pin. |
02-08-2012, 10:15 PM | #7 (permalink) | |
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Quote:
I looked at the MX-700 rewinding from Ralph's link and it looks like a nice base indeed. I got a brand-new MX-700 510KV from a local dealer, who took it out of a box, because the customer did not want it. Paid 125 bucks for it. Not too bad, I think. I'll take it apart tomorrow.
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02-08-2012, 10:34 PM | #8 (permalink) | |
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I would imagine 600MX is probably built the same as the 700MX.
Had a 600MX kicking around so tried to remove the stator. popped it in the freezer and a few taps pop right out. no pin just press fit maybe epoxy / locktite but didn't notice any residue. Quote:
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02-08-2012, 11:54 PM | #9 (permalink) |
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it makes no sense to jump from motor to motor inside one thread!
especially, if the second brought in motor is completely different and needs another scheme. it only increases the confusion and doesn't help anyone. sorry. |
02-09-2012, 08:21 AM | #10 (permalink) | |
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Quote:
could you please elaborate a little bit on the "intestines" of your 600MX motor? As far as I know, there are two different ones. Just to see, if it is comparable to the 700-MX Kv? Number of slots and poles? How many strands and turns? Y or D configuration?
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02-09-2012, 11:49 AM | #11 (permalink) | |
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600MX Kv 1220 which is 9N6P motor
I was unable to decipher the number of turns and align has no info regarding those specs. in my limited understanding it look very close to a scorpion 3025 motor with slight stator size diameter and height difference if I dare to say before someone freaks out this link may be the same motor. http://www.scorpion.powercroco.de/12N8P3026.html just my observation so I let the experts confirm this. Quote:
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02-09-2012, 11:53 AM | #12 (permalink) |
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if it is 9N6P it is completely wrong in this thread.
you should open a new one about it. btw: there are also 9N6P HK 3026 scorpions outside. http://www.scorpion.powercroco.de/9N6P3026G2.html seems, you have a really good hand to bring all threads in confusion........ |
02-09-2012, 12:12 PM | #13 (permalink) |
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Yeah HeliFX,
it really looks like you should open your own thread with your 600MX 9N6P, if it is indeed one of those. Otherwise it will be really confusing when we talk about the different winding schemes. Don't worry, nobody will bite you here. . . We are here to help each other.
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Kind Regards ZT - TDR, No problem can be solved from the same level of consciousness that created it.(AE) |
02-09-2012, 12:29 PM | #14 (permalink) | |
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yeah agree with having a different thread.
I was just making reference to removing the stator as a comparison to the 700mx not so much schematics. fair enough we can keep it on topic cheers Quote:
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02-11-2012, 12:50 PM | #15 (permalink) |
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Here we go,
below is the dismantled 700-MX. The process of getting the stator off is described in the Stator Removal thread. The original winding is 6+6D with a strand of 9 x 0.3mm wires. The stator is a 4232. I would like to rewind it with a 1.25mm wire and would opt for 7+8YY. Why? My calculation resulted in about 475 Kv, which would be perfect for my TDR 800 project.
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Kind Regards ZT - TDR, No problem can be solved from the same level of consciousness that created it.(AE) |
02-11-2012, 01:00 PM | #16 (permalink) |
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how much winding experience have you?
7+8x1,25YY will not be easy to wind. interesting was, that the stronger (broader) magnets from 4035 (V3) lowered the n spec as much, that 6+6YY gave 500/V ! so just 6+7YY would give 470/V and would be easy windable with 1,25 or 1,32mm wire. may be, 1,4 is also good and 1,5 possible for expirienced winders. |
02-11-2012, 01:01 PM | #17 (permalink) |
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The 700-MX has a unique shaft which bulges out at the top of the 8mm part to save on a washer and a c-clip.
That made the removal of the shaft a little bit more difficult. I had to remove the two grub screws and push the shaft towards the top in order to get it out of the bell. That revealed, that the upper bearing was glued to the shaft, because it came out of the seat during this process. Not a good idea. Better have the bearing glued into its seat of the bracket. Besides the hassle with the stator (see stator removal thread) it wasn't too bad at all. I am still entertaining the idea of using a Scorpion shaft lateron (I got this from the German guys, who did the rewind already) This would let me the stator center nicely with shims and a c-clip and easier to install and remove later.
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02-11-2012, 04:53 PM | #18 (permalink) | |
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Quote:
I have no experience except some test windings. I am still waiting for my insulation paper and wire from Brocott. In the meantime I try to get as much information and discussion going as possible and get as much tools prepared as possible. The winding would be probably easier with 6+7YY or even 6+6YY, but that would require to take the original magnets off and glue the bigger ones into place. I read your chapters about those procedures and this requires absolute precision and a good workmanship. I am not afraid about the workmanship. With the proper tools, foresight, everything is doable. I just see this as something what is over my head at the moment. I'll be happy, if one of my projects (700-MX or HK4225 kit) results into a partial-motor-test-run, without ending up in smoke. But the magnet change is still interesting enough to talk about. . . Thinking about it, one question comes to my mind. From what I saw and read in Florian Kinzer's guest contribution at your site, it turned out, that he did not only use stronger magnets, but the slightly bigger magnets also reduced the air gap. I did not know that this would result in a lower ns. I know, that the force is transferred through the air-gap and the smaller the gap, the more force can be transferred, but the lowering of the ns is new to me. But hey, what do I know, I am just starting to grasp the concept.
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02-11-2012, 11:17 PM | #19 (permalink) |
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ZT, i'm more concerned about the mx on 800 blades, i think it's a little light under the collar for that, i'd think something like a 5025 or larger would be better suited. It all depends what you want from the heli though, just cruising around should probably work ok
I agree with Ralph (not brave enough to disagree!) that 1.25 for a first is making it difficult for yourself, but then i also see your point in having to glue new magnets in place etc, espescially for a first motor, i'd say a bit intimidating. I'd say try maybe 1.12 wire or perhaps a slightly faster kv for 700 size? |
02-14-2012, 10:12 AM | #20 (permalink) |
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Taking off the old windings on the 700-MX stator was not too difficult a job
I did it without cutting. Just started with one strand, wire by wire and then the other ones came pretty good. They used a little bit of CA, but no epoxy. I tried to recognize the scheme they wired it, but was not able to, because I left the termination intact. So I unwound very carefully not to damage the coating. The coating has some wire marks at the spots where I applied pressure with my small pieces of aluminum and the screws. I'll coat them later with black loctite 410 again or some epoxy. I am intending to use a pin or grub screw as a twist lock later and don't want to glue the stator in place to be able to remove it again. Any advice in regards here? I probably have to drill it a little bit bigger, if I use a grub screw and cut a thread.
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Kind Regards ZT - TDR, No problem can be solved from the same level of consciousness that created it.(AE) |
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