traveling flips

[Scott1115]

I am trying to 'get it' on the sim, but it is pathetic.

To describe; I am trying to fly left to right across field. Entering upright backwards, 1/2 back flip, flying inverted forward, half back flip, now flying upright inverted, etc.....

I cannot keep altitude nor forward (L to R) speed.

Please help smooth out manuever.

[gitbse]

Collective management. Hard to explain, and hard to teach, especially through only words. You need to get more disciplined with the left stick. That's the key to making any 3d move look good. Focus on which way the disc is pointing, either up, down, or in the direction you want to travel. In 3d flying, the collective always determines where the heli moves to.

[ArchmageAU]

Originally Posted by Scott1115

I am trying to 'get it' on the sim, but it is pathetic.

To describe; I am trying to fly left to right across field. Entering upright backwards, 1/2 back flip, flying inverted forward, half back flip, now flying upright inverted, etc.....

I cannot keep altitude nor forward (L to R) speed.

Please help smooth out manuever.

As gitsbe said. Collective management.

Think through the move. What happens when you drop the tail for the 1/2 flip from upright to inverted? What happens if I add too much neg collective too early during this flip? What happens between transitional and thrust base lift (ie. It should feel like to toss the heli into this move along the line, same inverted)? What happens to the CG through the move (what part keeps the line, the fuse or the blades. ie. in the first half are you vaulting the fuse onto the blades, or swinging the blades round the front of the fuse)?

Once you get these concepts, then practice slow speed on the sim to observe what is happening through the move. Then go full speed. It then just becomes timing the collective management.

Hope this helps.

[banditpowdercoat]

All in the timing. And you need more collective than a stationary flip based on your speed. A front traveling flip is easier. Not as much up collective needed as your already traveling with up collective. Then lots more neg collective to keep
Your fwd speed. The timing tho is off. No longer 0 pitch when vertical. Because when traveling. The heli is pitched fwd. the 0 pitch moment is 90* from your disk angle at fwd flight when you started the trav flip.


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[tacomaster]

are you trying to keep a constant forward speed or are you trying to travel a distance/ flip then travel? if you are trying to constantly travel you will have to always be feeding collective in and keep the cyclic pinned at the rate you want, usually half right stick is a good point.

you will need to feed full collective when the heli is vertical as in nose up or down and then
lower the collective and feed it back in next time the disc is about to be vertical.


try ascending and descending stationary flips first, once you get that the traveling flips will make much more sense, also once you get the traveling flips down, more complex transitions like FFF to FBF inverted will be seamless.

if you really want help i could make a small sim vid on it tonight if you want.

[RogerRabit]

To get the collective timing and disk loading into your thumbs you might use the following trick:

Use a nitro trainer in your sim. Dial it down to 70% power and +/-9 degrees (on a 700) so it just moves up 1-2m/sec on full pitch.

Then fly the following:

Slow forward. Now pull the cyclic back until the heli is vertical. Now fly it in a halfloop tail first and approx same height as you entered the first halflloop to the next halfloop.

Listen to the sound of the motor that should give you a idea on the collective management.

Now smoothen that halfloops (it is a kind of ballett) and take out the positive a little earlier and feed in the negative a little later. You will notice, that the heli will not go so much up till the vertical.
From there it is a feeling that you develop between speed in the horizontal line and the collective management.

Don´t concentrate too much. Travelling flips is a natural 2 axis move which should be a reflex. Let it drop a little too much, let it go a little too high, draw too much energie from the disk (wrong collective) and so on just to get the feeling.

Dial down the RPM and power of the head to the point where the heli is stable and fly it. That teaches you most.

[RogerRabit]

Originally Posted by banditpowdercoat

.. A front traveling flip is easier. Not as much up collective needed as your already traveling with up collective. .


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Did hear that a lot of times.
I prefer the backflip one. It always leads away from earth........

[banditpowdercoat]

With doing a fwd traveling backflip you need to really jam the collective neg when you pull back the cyclic. Or else you loose fwd momentum. Took me a while to get the collective speed down. Cause your going from tilting into the direction of travel (pos collective) to dropping the tail down and needing full neg collective to maintain speed. Atleast at the speeds I do them

Ps when you get them really good and do them consecutive, looks like the heli tumbling down the field like a ball rolling. A backflip looks really weird as its rolling in the reverse direction of travel. Really impressive to spectators


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