need help with tail tuning

[anthony1]

haven't been flying my x5 lately (cgy equipped) work etc. but I have been flying my ikon equipped logo480, and while the tail isn't perfect its a lot better than the cgy , I know it tuning but I don't know exactly what maneuvers to do to tune the tail . apart from that I really like the way the cgy flies , much more pure (only way I can think of describing it) so I would like to try and solve my tail issue.
its the same as its always been , in tik toks the tail appears to be doing figure eights, mild pitch pumps are ok but if I blip the collective the tail swings about 5 degrees before coming back on line . I tried ff and negative numbers make it better . any advice on this problem will be appreciated
thank you
Anthony

[anthony1]

so I went through the nick Maxwell video's again , ad this time I noticed that ff has 2 parameters a high and a low one, when I look at the tail whilst playing with the collective its very erratic mainly because I only have on side (high) set i'm hoping that this is my problem , I have set it so that as I move from positive to negative collective the tail moves to the left and vice versa , it looks smooth whereas it was jerky before so I know I will have to tune it while flying to get it correct but it looks promising , hopefully tomorrow I can get out and test my theory.
Anthony

[anthony1]

so I flew this morning and adjusted the ff o the rudder to get rid of the kick, I started with +- 30 . still a kick so I went to +- 20 and it got worse , so I went all the way (in increments) to +70 and -50 which feels wrong but its the best its been so far, now i'm thinking of reducing the ff and adding some acc to try and get the initial kick which is small out , I oticed that as I near the end of the flight the tail swings a little , but only with the older batteries ,
am I on the right track? for me this is all guess work
Anthony

[anthony1]

nobody has anything to offer?

[anthony1]

64 views and nothing!

[ttrip06]

Ok

1. Is the tail push rod smooth, straight with no bind?

2. Have you optimized the tail gain. How much gain are you running currently? You need to increase the tail gain till it starts talking to you then back it off a few percent. You can do this in hover initially, but it needs to be optimized for forward flight speed and fast banking turns. If it is to high it will wag coming out of turns.

After the gain is optimized and only then do you want to start adjusting the tail feed forward and acc mix. Set it high on the bench and make sure it is adding right tail rotor for positive/negative pitch (for clockwise rotation). Start with about 10% for flight testing on the feed forward mix and again make sure it is adding the mix in the correct direction. Remember there is a setting for both sides of the pitch curve it switches a 0 degree pitch.

If you hear the tail barking on hard punch outs add some acc mix till it quiets.That noise is the tail getting behind and trying to hang on. The acc mix helps for those quick hard punches.

3. Is the model gov? Are you practicing good collective engagement? No tail is going to keep up if you are overloading the model.

Hope this helps

Tim

[Full Montee]

Deleted post

[anthony1]

thank you for your reply
3>yes i'm using the cgy gov, and yes to the collective management , I am not overloading the tail . In consecutive forward flips which doesn't change the collective too dramatically the tail wanders
1. yes the tail is very smooth with no binding
2. I believe I have the tail to its maximum without any wags , I will have to check but for me I think its a little low , I have tried moving the ball out on the servo arm but then the left and right numbers for the movement are too high , right now they are around 100 in each direction . in a normal slowish pitch pump the heli goes up straight , in all other aspects the tail holds well , if I blip the throttle the tail swings , its very noticeable in tik toks at the change of collective, as I have it now its better in tik toks , I also have a lot of corrections to make in rainbows ,
I did try 30% to start and then 20% after that but it got worse so I went to 40% and then all the way to 70% {in 10% increments} inverted climbs the tail turned 45 degrees so I backed that parameter off until it didn't do it anymore and that was 50% , but I feel that its too much and that something else is probably wrong that .

[FLAU]

Hi Anthony, if you can put gain to the max without wags, you can try longer tail blades. Also you can try 'chiness wheights', this reduse the force on the servo. Frans