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Electric Motors Winding and Repair Electric Motors Winding and Repair Discussion |
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03-18-2012, 01:23 PM | #81 (permalink) |
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Yes I dropped the extra wind after contacting Sirolf. Now it has 510kv.
In the stator holder you can see the groove I made for the anti-rotation pin (was not present in the stock version). Here is a photo just before motor assembly:
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Raptor E700: PowerDekker Pyro650, JR DS8925HV & SPG01, 12s, Vortex VX1, Kosmik160, Jeti DS-16 Last edited by _Dekker; 03-20-2012 at 04:04 PM.. |
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03-18-2012, 03:20 PM | #82 (permalink) |
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saves me on buying another pinion and KDE motormount... Bert, keep up the good work. I'll buy you a drink at the 3D Masters
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KDS Chase 360 | Align Trex 600NSP | Align Trex 700E | Align Trex 700X |
03-20-2012, 03:13 PM | #83 (permalink) |
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I'll keep the drink in mind
I replaced the Align shaft with a Scorpion HKIII-4035 version, the one with 100mm total length. This way it is easier to change the bearings and to adjust the shaft for proper bearing clearance. Since it is no longer the original Align, I use my own logo. 125 is the wire thickness (1.25mm) and 510 speaks for itself. The 4035 shaft is a bit too long at the other end but shortening it will not really make it nicer anyway, so I leave it the way it is: New bearings installed and it is finished. Total weight 433gr.
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Raptor E700: PowerDekker Pyro650, JR DS8925HV & SPG01, 12s, Vortex VX1, Kosmik160, Jeti DS-16 |
03-20-2012, 03:52 PM | #84 (permalink) |
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Is the regular 4035 shaft too short?
And did you use the HK III shaft?
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Kind Regards ZT - TDR, No problem can be solved from the same level of consciousness that created it.(AE) |
03-20-2012, 03:57 PM | #85 (permalink) |
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Yes it is the HKIII shaft, it extends about 2mm more than the Align shaft. I edited my previous post to make it more clear.
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Raptor E700: PowerDekker Pyro650, JR DS8925HV & SPG01, 12s, Vortex VX1, Kosmik160, Jeti DS-16 |
03-20-2012, 04:06 PM | #86 (permalink) |
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That makes sense.
The "normal" version of the HK III 4035 shaft with 100 mm length. Thanks Bert. One more thing. Hitting the two holes on the bottom of the Align shaft with the set screws is a pain. I see, you dremeled a flat. Are you using only one set screw then?
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Kind Regards ZT - TDR, No problem can be solved from the same level of consciousness that created it.(AE) |
03-20-2012, 04:12 PM | #87 (permalink) |
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No I still use both setscrews, first I tighten the one on the flat and then the one on the outside of the shaft. This is the way it is done on all Scorpion motors I have seen so far.
Bert
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Raptor E700: PowerDekker Pyro650, JR DS8925HV & SPG01, 12s, Vortex VX1, Kosmik160, Jeti DS-16 |
03-20-2012, 04:25 PM | #88 (permalink) |
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PM to you!
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Kind Regards ZT - TDR, No problem can be solved from the same level of consciousness that created it.(AE) |
03-20-2012, 11:22 PM | #89 (permalink) |
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question for dekker,
was the stator epoxied or do you generally use M2 screw ? since I'll be assembling my motor soon is best to sand the holder so its a slight tight fit when using a M2 screw what's the best process you can advise when putting the motor back. I read different ways but not sure which is best. |
03-21-2012, 02:21 AM | #90 (permalink) | |
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I got nothing?
Quote:
The 700MX above had a very nice tight fit so here I drilled a 1.5mm hole and used a 1.5mm pin. For final assembly I glue the stator mount to the stator with UHU PLUS (epoxy). You could also use a heat resistant type of Loctite.
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Raptor E700: PowerDekker Pyro650, JR DS8925HV & SPG01, 12s, Vortex VX1, Kosmik160, Jeti DS-16 |
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03-21-2012, 08:02 AM | #91 (permalink) |
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I've been having an issue with my mx 1.32yy on the e 720 running 2200 on 690's. The jive would lower rpm dramatically, almost like a thermal but would then recover fairly quickly, after questioning this on k forum the answer i got here https://www.helifreak.com/showpost.p...54&postcount=2 (In case of bad BEMF reponses by the motor (commutation problems, e.g. the arriving times of pulses are far out of the calculated ETA) the JIVE reduces the PWM in trying to resychronize. RPM goes down and recovers then.)
This happens once in flight usually under some load, after that its fine and no flashing leds either as apparently no error occured. I'm thinking perhaps mags are not spaced equally but will first try ksa then smooth out pi values on jive to see if it works. Keep this in mind when you first try out the your rewinded motor.Also take extra care to check magnet spacing. i dont have the problem on the 1.25 in vibe e8 also 12s but not nearly as "loaded" since 600 blades and same headspeed. Its the only motor of all my rewinds doing this so can't think anything else than mags spacing. Ralph what's your guess? Thnx! |
03-21-2012, 08:15 AM | #92 (permalink) |
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Of course checking the magnets is the first thing to do. Also foreign matter might have damaged the winding.
But I think you may have an isolation problem at elevated temperature: an isotest at room temperature is exactly that and does not tell you what happens at say 100degrees. If the wind process was difficult and you were surprised to have no problems in the isotest, that elevates the chance of a high temp problem.
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Raptor E700: PowerDekker Pyro650, JR DS8925HV & SPG01, 12s, Vortex VX1, Kosmik160, Jeti DS-16 |
03-21-2012, 08:37 AM | #93 (permalink) |
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So heating up the whole motor in the oven to, let's say, 100 C could reproduce the problem on the test stand?
That would be interesting to see. I'll keep it in mind. I still have some time to gather info, since my wires left GB yesterday. . .
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03-21-2012, 08:40 AM | #94 (permalink) |
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I dont think temp Bert, it happens right away when motor still cold then later on in the flight flying hard when motor is much hotter its fine, also jive should give led flash warning if isolation problem as far as i know, my led is solid afterwards.
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03-21-2012, 09:07 AM | #95 (permalink) |
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Hmm okay. Did you check for shorts between windings (impedance of all wires equal)?
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Raptor E700: PowerDekker Pyro650, JR DS8925HV & SPG01, 12s, Vortex VX1, Kosmik160, Jeti DS-16 |
03-21-2012, 01:06 PM | #96 (permalink) |
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yes I check during winding, also partial motor tests kv, equal, I think it's more jive issue than anything else, for some reason even stock motor it's problematic on jive, most run ksa. I'll pull the motor apart if ksa doesn't help to check mag spacing
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03-21-2012, 09:18 PM | #97 (permalink) | |
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thanks dekker
can the pin be 1.5 mm magnet copper wire or does it need to be something like piano wire ? do you generally put epoxy on the windings or prefer not too ? Quote:
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03-22-2012, 03:21 AM | #98 (permalink) |
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I prefer piano wire since copper is soft and I do not like the idea of it shearing off.
Epoxy on the windings is a matter of preference. It helps to fixate loose windings against movement and vibrations and should also help to distribute heat a bit better. On the other hand it makes it more difficult to take the windings off again. On the 700mx wind I did above I did not use epoxy: the cooling is just fine and the wire cannot go anywhere. Bert
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Raptor E700: PowerDekker Pyro650, JR DS8925HV & SPG01, 12s, Vortex VX1, Kosmik160, Jeti DS-16 |
03-25-2012, 07:48 AM | #99 (permalink) |
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Ok at last i got the low kv done, i expect in the vincinity of 340kv, but left wires long if i need to go lower so i can squeeze in perhaps 2-3 extra windings per pair.
Winding is yy in 1.12mm wire 10+10, not my neatest work but limited time so had to hurry this through. 1000 v test done, now only eagle tree the 2 motors. Waiting for scorpion shaft though, tired of lining up the little dimples! I'm planning to use this in tdr at low headspeed, but then another idea sprung up if i get bored with the efp. What about 14 or 16 s, now that kv is low enough? Would appreciate your thoughts on this Ralph, how would this motor compare on 16s vs higher kv in lets say 1.32 wire on 12 s or is it 6 of one half a dozen of the other? Amp draw should be lower for sure |
03-25-2012, 08:06 AM | #100 (permalink) |
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some test pilots use motors winded for 14S and 16S in "suzi laos" and "banshee".
also look here: http://www.scorpion.powercroco.de/12N10P4540serie.html and here: http://www.scorpion.powercroco.de/sc...alculator.html the power is insane and it will need a really strong gear to use it. and a special controller like yge 160 UHV, but to get high torquee and a good efficiency curve you will need a bigger motor. in smaller motors the high number of turns and the low coppersquare will generate a small high eta peak like curve number 2, the bigger ones 3 up to 5. http://www.powerditto.de/EtaAuslegung.html |
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