Spartan AP2000i or Robbe Heli Command?

[Aguia2]

Thanks for the file Angelos. In my case it still needed a little tweaking but it works now!
Thanks for the nice support!

Emilio

[sparky]

This AP 20001, does it stabalize the heli or the camera mount?

How much approx does it cost?

How much trouble setting it up on the heli?

How hard to learn it?

Thanks in advance!

John

[catfight]

sparky,

AP2000i cost $205 for unit+$80 for FMA IR sensor- you have to order elsewhere,+PC cable and IR cable at $60 or so)

It stabiliizes the heli and you need a channel on your radio for the gain/calibrate feature (I use 6 channel and connect gyro to unused port for gyro gain- manual)

It senses the horizon (diff in temp of the ground and sky generally). You get it above the trees in a hover, hit calibrate switch for about 2 sec and release - giving you a reference horizon). In operation you just let go of the cyclic stick and it hovers except for wind drift.

Pretty cool device - I just put in my T600 last week and it was easy install if you can read directions (which I couldn't at first )

[MarkWebber]

John

The AP2000i is designed for stabilizing your helicopter. It is not difficult to install or operate. I sell the system (less IR sensor) for 252.15USD plus shipping. The IR sensor is available from fmadirect.com.

[sparky]

Thanks both to catfight and mark!
After my wife coms back down from the purchase of the Trex 600 and I get more comfortable flying, I will definitly be getting this!
Should be a way to get some of the investment back as no one where I live is doing anything like this! Also, just for my own pleasure in photogrify!

John

[catfight]

sparky,

You might want to get this first to save on parts budget

[sparky]

Catfight,
Can you still give inputs to the cyclic while it is on, or do you have to shut it down first to move around?
And correct me if I am wrong, but your gyro stays in heading hold all the time?
so when you first set up the heli, use chanel 6 for set up in normal, set the gain, then move it to an open port on the rx?

Remember, I am an oldschool planker and never had to deal with advanced electronics to fly? Most indepth I have ever been is mixing flaperons! LOL!

[MLaBoyteaux]

Your cyclic inputs go through the AP-2000 so you always have control of the heli. What the AP-2000 does is make corrections to keep the heli level. As you increase the gain on the stabilizer, the more authority it has. At a high setting, you can intentionally roll the heli over to say 45 or 60 degrees and let go of the cyclic. The heli will right itself very rapidly.

When the gain is set high, the cylic will feel "stiff" because the stabilizer has so much authority.

At a lower setting, it will take longer for the stabilizer to level the heli, but it feels more natural in forward flight because you won't feel like your having to "fight" against the stabilzer.

Since the Heading Hold gyro is on the rudder channel, it's not affected by the AP-2000.

However, because some installations are short a spare channel for gain control, it is possible to use the #5 receiver output to control the gain of the AP-2000. This channel is normally used to control the gain for the rudder gyro.

So what you do in this situation, is use the spare output from the AP-2000 and program it to provide a constant output which simulates the gain for the rudder gyro. The downside is you no longer have the ability to change your gyro gain from the transmitter, but most of us using it for AP never change the gyro gain anyway! Mine is always set to 70% and I never change it once I've got the heli set up properly.

I've got 3 AP rigs (2 gassers and an electric Raptor) and all 3 of them have AP-2000's on them. I would also recommend them for low time pilots. I would NOT suggest they are a substitute for a competent instructor, but they will help you master nose in hovering without breaking your heli as often

[catfight]

I concur with Laboyteaux on all points I only have 6 channels so I use ch 5 (gear) and then with some fancy mixing with switches (I can't even explain that to you ) I use 2 switches, 1 for off/enabled (to some preset gain setting on the AP2000i) and the other switch to momentarily throw it into calibrate and then back off. People with 7 channels or more can use a "slider" to adjust the gain any way they want! This works for me though!

[sparky]

I see said the blind man! Makes a lot of sense! I bet I could even be able to teach my wife to fly with it!
I have over 60 hours on the sim, quite a few on a indoor heli, and I am anxious to see how the 600 flys in comparison to the hours spent on the sim! On the sim, about 60% of the time, I have no problems on nose in hover. My battel now is side in landing at around what I think is 20 feet in front of me. Can tic toc, rolls, flips, and loops no problem, inverted hover is a crash about 80% of the time at 10 to 15 feet off the ground.

luckly i have 26 days off at a time just for practice. Learned to hover tail in before I got the sim, but that is on fixed pitch!

Thanks again catfight! You have been extreamly helpfull! Wish we could get together for a fly and a chat! but you are almost 20,000 miles away!

[sparky]

Thank you too mlaboyteaux!

[MarkWebber]

Trex 600, eh? Sweet heli. I got to see one flying about 3 weeks ago. Amazing how smooth those electrics are. Will make a fine platform for the AP2000i :wink: And, as you can see, there's plenty of help on here if you find yourself uncertian about the install.

[sparky]

Thanks alot mark, and it would be a safe bet to place that when it arrives, I will have some questions onthe install! But, I do love a challange! :twisted: I think all on this site do, or we would not be flying RC!!!!!!!! :wink:

[xircom]

I have seen many Q&A now about this AP2000i, but also on others like Stabilizer (General Laser), now for me it looks AP2000i is the better system, especially future proof when the inertial sensor will be out (although probably this is going to be a lot more expensive, maybe twice the box). But I have a question about using this box for *** 3D flight training (safety net, with some limits of course) ***, which of those would better suit. The issue is, that stabilizer (3D version) can handle inverted flight (although I would not mind if heli "swapped" in dangerous situations, but stay is of course better), whereas AP2000i cannot (?) - from feature point of view, the AP2000i does not need extensive calibration in the air, and also its SW seems to be better. Which would you buy in this situation (can wait maybe January of course). Thanks so much :idea:

[Angelos]

The current AP-2000i software will always bring the helicopter upright if you turn on the stabiliser for a quick bailout. There is a method to configure the AP-2000i for inverted hover but I want to test it myself before I make it publicly known.

-Angelos

[GGoodrum]

The CoPilot had another sensor for detectig inverted flight, I think.

[Angelos]

Gary,
You are right; the co-pilot Z sensor is to detect when you are inverted but it is only useful for airplanes. Airplanes can bailout faster and lose less altitude with a half roll than a half loop. The Z sensor is used so that the stabiliser knows the airplane is inverted and apply roll correction only until it comes upright… then apply pitch correction too to keep if flying level.

With helicopters it makes no difference if you roll or flip or any combination of the too. The stabiliser applies corrections on both axis and the helicopter will follow the shortest and therefore fastest path upright. This can be done without the Z sensor.

-Angelos

[xircom]

uh, so that means when I over inverted and low releasing the sticks, the AP2000 would hit me into ground, because it want to get the heli upright ?

[Angelos]

The AP-2000i will not let you fly inverted when upright stabilisation is enabled. However, if you are inverted with stabilisation off and then you turn stabilisation on the AP-2000i will flip the helicopter upright.

Similarly, if you set the AP-2000i for inverted stabilisation it will flip the helicopter inverted as soon as you turn stabilisation on.

How is your preference. How do you want it to work?

[xircom]

obviously in most cases, first is preferred, because going inverted automatically from horizontal sounds a bit scary - but of course for inverted training second. Wishful would be of course in case of 0-90deg normal and 90-180 inverted automatically - is that only possible with z-sensor. If not it would be nice also to set it remotely ?

Also I'd wish to know the advantages from AP2000i, compared to other products, one of them is the upcoming inertial sensors (which I have understood are quite around the corner), the other one is very good support, then I think it does not need really calibration flight. Is that right, and are there other ones ? Of course for this purpose being "safety net", not for AP as such.

Thanks a lot !