TRex 450SE on 3S A123

[Bill Sanford]

I'm using the Dimension Engineering Park BEC and have never had an issue in MANY flights.

Bill

[kgfly]

What servos do you run on your 450SE with the ParkBEC Bill ?

[Bill Sanford]

Originally Posted by kgfly

What servos do you run on your 450SE with the ParkBEC Bill ?

HS65MG on cyclic and 401 / 9650 on the tail.

Bill

[kgfly]

OK, so 3 x analog, gyro + 1 x digital all comfy within the 1.25A rating. Good to know.

[JustPlaneChris]

I'm running 3x Hyperion DS09-AMD, 401 and 9650 on a ParkBEC without issue.

[kgfly]

I am lugging around a 13g SportBEC on my 450 (3 x HS65MG, LT2100+little digital tail servo) so I guess I could free it up for a bigger model and save 7g and a little space with a ParkBEC instead Maybe next time. More likely I will swap the CC45+BEC for a K-Force 40 with the built in SBEC, much more convenient IMO.

[Mac_Heli]

Originally Posted by kgfly

I am lugging around a 13g SportBEC on my 450 (3 x HS65MG, LT2100+little digital tail servo) so I guess I could free it up for a bigger model and save 7g and a little space with a ParkBEC instead Maybe next time. More likely I will swap the CC45+BEC for a K-Force 40 with the built in SBEC, much more convenient IMO.

I went with the 35A Hyperion ESC w/ SBEC, great option, leaner setup, less wiring, but 35A is not enough, I wish I had picked their 50A...

So 2 points for parkBEC and none for SportBEC (kgfly's setup is 4s). I'm still wondering if I should sell the CC45A, SportBEC and Hyperion 35A CC/SBEC and get the Hyperion 50A ...

Today I had the Hyperion 35A back in, 3 flawless flights...

So Bill, the bog is a weather issue? have you tried a 14T w/ govenor?

[Bill Sanford]

Originally Posted by Mac_Heli

I went with the 35A Hyperion ESC w/ SBEC, great option, leaner setup, less wiring, but 35A is not enough, I wish I had picked their 50A...

So 2 points for parkBEC and none for SportBEC (kgfly's setup is 4s). I'm still wondering if I should sell the CC45A, SportBEC and Hyperion 35A CC/SBEC and get the Hyperion 50A ...

Today I had the Hyperion 35A back in, 3 flawless flights...

So Bill, the bog is a weather issue? have you tried a 14T w/ govenor?

I haven't tried a 14 tooth pinion. It may help, but I think I'm just sort of at the limit of what 3s A123 can do.

A123s also don't like cold and northern MN is COLD much of the year. We've had one day where it was close to 70 degrees so far this year and the A123s were much happier that day. On 50 degree days the A123s don't put out as much power until after 1 flight and a fast charge. The second flight is much better.

I think my bogging is just pushing too hard and expecting too much form the heli. I've got +-13 pitch and fly VERY hard. Not wild 3D but fast, big air flying. This sucks a lot of power. If I get it going flat out and pull through a corner with full collective I can certainly slow the head down. I put new bearings in my HK2221-6 late this winter and just changed them again last night because they were beginning to squeal. The top bearing was much worse than the bottom. I put it in the Greaser just to see what would come out of the bearing, and you wouldn't believe all the black ugly grease that came out. This black gunk is worn metal! Ther bearing was obviously shot. I'll bet I didn't get more than 60-70 flights on this set of bearings. I think it's beause I'm pushing the power system very hard.

We had a radar gun at the field and on a downwind run in a dive I got the 450 going 64 mph! Not bad considering that a nitro 600 had to make several passes to get up to the same speed.

Bill

[Epoweredrc]

Originally Posted by Bill Sanford

HS65MG on cyclic and 401 / 9650 on the tail.

Bill

Oh yeah dang some told me parkbec wouldnt be enough. thats good to know your using one and its working.

[super coop]

i also have been dealing with tail issues using the cc set rpm gov
figetty bounce type wag that comes an goes. i went thru the tail thinking it was binding .
but didnt see a problem .kgfly thanks for posting your experience.
ive since lowered the gain to 1 it has got better but cant go any lower. ill try adj the rpm in small increments. T2O did Castle say
anything about going up or down in hdsp.
an what about the hdsp change rate setting.

you guys were asking about bec's thought i would post
I remember a time before the 450s
when the lite machine was king. a common setup was a CC35 an a mega 16/15/3
brushed motors were out, brushless inrunners were all the rave!
People were running Nicads an nimhs what 7.2 or 9.6 v
boom lipos hit the market 11.1v 12.6v
thats when folks started having esc shutdowns due to the bec overheating
having to drop the higher 12 v down to 5 v. you could tell on the CC35
because it melted a small square in the heat shrink were the bec is on the esc.
I was running a 555 rec gy401 3x hs 81s .i had a shutdown after 8 mins of flying
on a hot day. Then i realized what happened when i saw the hole in the heat shrink,
it created its on cooling.
Bam! the miracal from the heli gods the park bec hit the market.
Any way is this the mythbusters reason we use them today.
I also got a servo sense plus that will read the current usage on your control circuit
i think it was right at the bec rating , an that was with the larger servos.
Since switching to 3s a123, i thought about removing the the park bec.
Do you think we need it running the lower voltage with a123s.

[kgfly]

Originally Posted by super coop

Since switching to 3s a123, i thought about removing the the park bec. Do you think we need it running the lower voltage with a123s.

YES. I would not trust the linear BEC in a CC ESC. On the other I happily run the linear BEC in the Align ESCs on 3S lipo (or 3S A123) with no problems and no overheating issues. For 4S A123 I would only consider a switched-mode BEC, either integrated or external. So if you want to fly a CC ESC I would definitely recommend an external SBEC for any setup, lipo or A123.

[Bill Sanford]

Originally Posted by super coop

Do you think we need it running the lower voltage with a123s.

One of my 450s just uses the CC35 on-board BEC and seems to work fine. The lower voltage of the A123 cells requires the on-board BEC to shed less power dropping the input voltage to 5 volts.

One advantage to consider with the Park BEC is that 6 volts is available to speed up the servos. On cyclic I don't notice as big of an improvement as I do on the tail. Both of my 450s use 401/9650 and on the 6 volt setup with the Park BEC the tail holds much tighter than the 5 volt powered setup.

Bill

[Mac_Heli]

Originally Posted by kgfly

YES. I would not trust the linear BEC in a CC ESC. On the other I happily run the linear BEC in the Align ESCs on 3S lipo (or 3S A123) with no problems and no overheating issues. For 4S A123 I would only consider a switched-mode BEC, either integrated or external. So if you want to fly a CC ESC I would definitely recommend an external SBEC for any setup, lipo or A123.

+1, I burnt my finger on the CC ESC during swash plate setup after about 5 minutes of it on... I had the JR servos that come with the DX7, I think they are digital...

Originally Posted by Bill

One advantage to consider with the Park BEC is that 6 volts is available to speed up the servos. On cyclic I don't notice as big of an improvement as I do on the tail. Both of my 450s use 401/9650 and on the 6 volt setup with the Park BEC the tail holds much tighter than the 5 volt powered setup.

There are 2 flavors of parkBEC, 5v and 6v. The 6v requires a minimum of 3s lipos to run, just like the SportBEC... The 5V works on 2s lipo.

[Bill Sanford]

Originally Posted by Mac_Heli

There are 2 flavors of parkBEC, 5v and 6v. The 6v requires a minimum of 3s lipos to run, just like the SportBEC... The 5V works on 2s lipo.

I run the 6 volt version on 3s A123 and have had no problems whatsoever...

Bill

[Epoweredrc]

my 1st b400 I was flying it with stock then switched toCC25 esc no extra BEC was going over pitch one afternoon the servos got really slow after moving controls really fast so i added a DE sport BEC next day...

my 2nd newest B400 got stock esc no bec for now I need to get one ut they both flew fine w/o on 4S A123 1100's but i am sure the ESC is getting hot best set up is with a external BEC.

I run 9V or 8V (sorry sleep since set it lol)cut off and it lets mew know the heli slowly starts slowning down I know its time to land but I fly to a timer and pretty good about guessing time.


I ran 3cell A123 2300's in a airplane for 100 flights with the DE sport BEC on 5v and never had a issue.

[super coop]

i see your point, it was a random thought, to much trouble to remove it anyway.
it does make a convenient point to hook the castle link up
kgfly did you see castle has a new gov
https://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=137652

[kgfly]

Thanks, I did not see that yet, I will monitor the feedback for a while before trying the update.

[Bill Sanford]

Originally Posted by super coop

i see your point, it was a random thought, to much trouble to remove it anyway.
it does make a convenient point to hook the castle link up
kgfly did you see castle has a new gov
New beta governor for CC users (CastleCreations) - HeliFreak

I haven't tried this yet in my 450s but I have in both of my HV85s in my two TRex 600s and it is an awesome update. All wags and overspeed issued in the governor are gone!!

Bill

[deswong]

These are my current settings - does anyone see anything that needs to be changed?

################################################## #####
# Castle Link Data File
# Created: Saturday, 16 May 2009
# Do Not Edit This File By Hand
################################################## #####
Hex55: 85
Brake Strength: 0
Brake Delay: .6 sec (Delayed) (*)
Brake Ramp: Immediate (*)
Cutoff Voltage: 60
Current Limiting: Insensitive
Cutoff Type: Soft Cutoff
Motor Start Power: 59
Direction: Forward (*)
PWM Rate: 8 Khz
Vehicle Type: Helicopter
Throttle Type: Governor Mode
Throttle Response: 5
Governor Gain: 14
Initial Spool-Up Rate: 5
Head Speed Change Rate: 5
Auto Rotate Enabled: False
Governor Mode Type: High
Vehicle Setup - Battery Type: A123
Vehicle Setup - Number of Cells: 3
Vehicle Setup - Battery Voltage: 9.9000
Vehicle Setup - Gear Ratio: 13.633
Vehicle Setup - Motor Kv: 4400
Vehicle Setup - Motor Number of Poles: 6
Desired Head Speed 1: 2411
Desired Head Speed 2: 2508
Desired Head Speed 3: 2713
Motor Timing: 0
Power-On Beep: Disabled
Auto-Lipo Volts/Cell: 3.0 Volts/Cell (*)

[t2o]

What is the cut -off voltage 60?

Many disable the cutoff voltage completely with A123

You are running an 11 tooth pinion? I dont think the ESC will be able to maintan your 2713 rpm. I have found that my packs average around 2.7 volts per cell over the course of the flight. With the 11T that gets you only about 2500 and thats at 95% eff. Of course your results may be better than mine.