Leading edge on blade grip

[BobOD]

Well, I just FREAKING LOVE helicopters!!! Everything about them.

[Penguin]

Originally Posted by t2o

It looks like the mod stock head is very close to zero-delta; so you should notice NO change in performance going from trail, to lead edge. Some even claim the trail edge is better becuase if a grip link fails, the heli will still fly.

The RC Heli Magazine stock mod is really not too close to zero delta and the link going to the swash is at quite an angle. The first picture below is a pic of the stock mod, traling edge control, positive delta. Second pic shows how I flipped to leading edge control, negative delta, and straighten the link to the swash a little by swapping out to a longer ball. It made quite a bit of difference in the way the heli flew, especially for tic-tocs and other rapid changes between positive and negative pitch to include just maintaining a consistent altitude in hover. It seemed to smooth out the pop. I didn't really like negative delta at first but I think it was because I wasn't used to it. I am now used to it and I am glad I made the change.

[caralmar]

Thanks for the pics! Now, where did you install the longer ball links?

Maybe I'm just lucky, but I can hold a very steady hover, even in the wind with minimal stick input... Could it be the Radix blades also make a diff here?

Oh, and do you use a separate BEC?

I'm getting concerned. Last few packs I see the satellite on the AR6200 blinking. The main receiver light is solid. The Align BEC is supposed to be a switching BEC... capable of continuous 3A and 5A bursts... thought this would be enough to power the 3 DS510s, Skookum, GY401, and 9257 on the tail.

[t2o]

penguin,

Your picture shows it (negative delta) much better than caralmar's-- which looked almost zero.

So which way did you like better, negative or positive delta?

[Penguin]

Originally Posted by caralmar

Thanks for the pics! Now, where did you install the longer ball links?...Oh, and do you use a separate BEC?

I'm getting concerned. Last few packs I see the satellite on the AR6200 blinking. The main receiver light is solid.

See attached picture showing which ball links I changed. I couldn't find one that would give me a perfect 90 degrees to the swash. I do not use a BEC. I have 150+ flights with SK360 and no BEC. I have never heard of the satellite blinking but not the main receiver. Sounds like a bad connection to your satellite to me. Maybe try checking to make sure its plugged in good or swapping out the satellite to test.

[caralmar]

DUH! LOL... DUH DUH DUH! I kept looking at the swash on my bird thinking, how the heck did he fit a longer link here and not bind w/ the swash posts! LOL

Thanks! I'll double check the satellite too... good to hear you're not using a separate BEC.

[BobOD]

Originally Posted by caralmar

I'm getting concerned. Last few packs I see the satellite on the AR6200 blinking. The main receiver light is solid. The Align BEC is supposed to be a switching BEC... capable of continuous 3A and 5A bursts... thought this would be enough to power the 3 DS510s, Skookum, GY401, and 9257 on the tail.

It's too bad to waste the weight and real estate for an external BEC but I would get one if I were you. You're borderline at best.

[Penguin]

Originally Posted by t2o

penguin, ... So which way did you like better, negative or positive delta?

I did not like the negative delta at first and was considering swapping back to positive delta because it just didn't feel right or did not feel as responsive maybe. I've since got used to it and I believe the added stability has helped my flying progress. With positive delta, I could come straight down very fast and pop the heli into a hover and it snapped into place. When I did tic tocs with positive delta, the heli would bounce with each direction change. With negative delta, the stops are much smoother but I can still make it snap with a little more collective stick movement and tic-tocs are very smooth now with no bounce. I like it now and would not switch back to positive with my current set-up.

[BobOD]

Penguin, I think you have it backwards. The leading edge setup results in negative delta and the trailing edge produces positive. If I read you correctly, the bottom picture is the one you prefer and that is neg. delta....which is more stable and predictable.
Yes?

[Penguin]

Originally Posted by BobOD

Penguin, I think you have it backwards. The leading edge setup results in negative delta and the trailing edge produces positive. If I read you correctly, the bottom picture is the one you prefer and that is neg. delta....which is more stable and predictable.
Yes?

Oops - You are correct Bob! I like the bottom set-up (negative delta) better because it is more stable and predictable. I just forgot which set-up was positive and which was negative. I'm gonna fix my previous posts so I don't mess someone up.

FYI - I made the switch to the bottom set-up after Bob suggested it to me! I probably have about 50 flights with the negative delta set-up now. Thanks Bob.

I would still like to upgrade to your I2 head some day.

[caralmar]

Ok, I made the switch last night and I'm glad I took her apart. While taking the head off, I hear a "clink" sound and look at my tail. The second of 3 bolts that hold a side the tail case fell on my desk! Hmm... maybe that's why my tail was a bit "jumpy"...LOL!

Pics are at zero pitch.



I used a swashplate ball link..its a few mm longer. I don't have any longer ones...anyone know which ones would fit better here?

[caralmar]

Ok, what am I missing here? Now with this setup, when I go full collective, I get negative pitch and vice-versa...

I know I can reverse pitch channel on the radio, and I did that and she flies fine... but is this "normal"? Or is there something I missed in the head setup?

Thanks for the help!

[BobOD]

It's because you are changing direction since the input and output are on opposite sides of the lever pivot. It's not really a problem...just if you miss this little detail before the maiden. I'm glad you didn't do that.

[caralmar]

Originally Posted by BobOD

It's because you are changing direction since the input and output are on opposite sides of the lever pivot. It's not really a problem...just if you miss this little detail before the maiden. I'm glad you didn't do that.

LOL! The thing is that I did! Got to the field, all excited to try out my "new" head conversion and I can't lift off! I see the landing gear being pushed down... so I think gravity has reversed itself somehow! No worries, got it figured out at the field... it was puzzling at first though!

Ok, so you're saying, I'm fine with reversing the pitch channel on the radio and just getting used to seeing the swash moving up for negative pitch... correct?

EDIT: BTW, thanks a lot Bob!

[BobOD]

To be frank, it would bug the crap out of me.
But, I really can't think of a good reason it would affect the flight.

[caralmar]

LOL! Bob, get out of my head please. Yes, it bugs the crap out of me... but I don't know what to do about it. Can't afford your loot!

[Penguin]

Originally Posted by caralmar

Ok, so you're saying, I'm fine with reversing the pitch channel on the radio and just getting used to seeing the swash moving up for negative pitch... correct?

Hmm, pitch channel on the radio is probably just one servo, it is on mine anyway. You need to reverse the sign of pitch in the swashmix but maybe that is what you did. I changed it within the Skookum setup though, see attached screen.

See this post https://www.helifreak.com/showpost.p...14&postcount=8

[caralmar]

Originally Posted by Penguin

Hmm, pitch channel on the radio is probably just one servo, it is on mine anyway. You need to reverse the sign of pitch in the swashmix but maybe that is what you did. I changed it within the Skookum setup though, see attached screen.

See this post https://www.helifreak.com/showpost.p...14&postcount=8

Thanks. Yeah, reversing the channel on the radio is basically the same thing as reversing it on the SK360. It flies fine this way... I'm just having an internal crisis going on because my brain is refusing to accept that positive pitch = swash down... I plan on taking myself outside later on and get a good smackdown going... Fight Club style!

[Penguin]

Originally Posted by caralmar

...I'm just having an internal crisis going on because my brain is refusing to accept that positive pitch = swash down... I plan on taking myself outside later on and get a good smackdown going... Fight Club style!

I started out with a Blade 400 so I didn't have any internal issues with swash direction but I promise you it flies just fine! Let us know how the smack-down goes.

[BobOD]

A bottle of Jack helps too. NO! Find something that comes in a plastic bottle. You won't hurt yourself so bad.

HMMMM...get a blade 400 for a while is another solution I guess. NAH, I like Caralmar's idea better....at least you'll heal after beating yourself silly.