rebuild

[Scream]

Hi Freaks!

I got a used warp V1 and have updated most of the parts except the alu tail case. The main pulley guide was damaged in the mail and the replacement flange was just as bad so I tried to make the best and use the 2 least out of round guides. I also sanded the frame a little bit and yes, I have the OWB shim installed. The original owner had installed the belt guides way too tight and they were binding so I cleaned the bearings and rebuilt as per the manual (v2). All seems smooth now, but this is my 1st dual belt drive system so I'm not sure how it should feel in regards to belt tension.

I've got to the point where I've spooled her up without blades, and it seems theres a slight resonance while its picking up speed. When sitting on a glass table it did move about a bit, but the frame felt smooth to the touch @ 70 or 100% Throttle. The pushrod seems a bit viby so I plugged vbar into my pc and it said the actual vibes were between 80-120 @100% without blades.

Is this acceptable or did I misalign something with the belt guides maybe?

I'm sure these are stupid questions but im basically rebuilding a bird I've never seen in proper condition and I'd appreciate any insights! Thanks a lot guys!

Cheers!
-=S=-

[RudeRebel]

Not stupid questions at all. The Warp's design is not a typical one so why not lean on the experience of others.

I adjust my main belt first, and have it snug. Not banjo tension, but only a little give when I press it from the side.

On initial spool up, I also get a slight heli-bounce but it goes away once the head gets up to speed. I think this is due to the blades getting themselves straightened up on a damperless, rigid head via centrifugal forces (opinion, not fact).

[Scream]

Thanks RudeRebel!

The warp manual suggests some weird end points for the tail slider... I'm assuming from reading other posts that if you don't use those points you must go from 12 to 8mm on the servo horn? how did you set yours?

Just a bit anxious to maiden as I cant find more than 1 part in stock(that I need) at the same shop, and it took 3 weeks of waiting to get this far!

Thanks in advance!
cheers!
-=S=-

[RudeRebel]

No problem Scream.

The two aren't directly related. I have my ball at 8mm. At 12mm, it takes very little throw of the servo to change the tail pitch, otherwise noted as increased mechanical gain.

As for the tail pitch endpoints, in general, there is no need for any pitch beyond +/- 45 degrees on the tail. Like many others, I do not have a good method for measuring tail pitch. I'm pretty sure the Compass suggested endpoints either limit the tail pitch to +/- 45 degrees, or some pitch value below 45 which they have deemed optimal. I have my endpoints set as the manual suggested. Had I not been happy with the tail's performance, I would have had no issue deviating, but it's working or me so why change.

As for parts, I'm just as puzzled as you as to why stock is so insufficient. To save on shipping costs, and also to maximize the number of stores we order from, a couple of the guys I fly with and I pool together orders. My strategy for spares is that I research the usual suspects for each of my helis and initially stock doubles. As I use one of the spares, I keep a list handy by my PC of everything I need to order and randomly check which retailer is carrying most or all of what I need. In this way, if one of the guys is placing an order somewhere, I'll ask them to get me a particular part. Likewise, if I am placing an order, I let them know I am so they can add to my order. It's a great system, especially for those of us in Canada where we are almost guaranteed to wait at least a week for delivery. I guess I answered my own puzzle; its horders like me who buy up all the parts, LOL.

[BaconRaygun]

Regarding belt tension, the general rule seems to be 'just tight enough that the belt does not skip on the pulley'.

"...the hell does that ACTUALLY mean?"

Flip the heli over so that you can see the pinion, tighten the belt to the point where the belt fully wraps around the pinion without lifting off prematurely due to its own flexibility limits, and that's it, absolutely no tighter than this. In fact, it can even be biased to the looser side.

The tail belt, you should be able to push it about 1cm with your finger with little force. You can use this tip for the main belt too, but it will require a little more force so its best to go with method one and then learn the 'feel' for the future.

[Scream]

I finally maidened her! Holy crapcakes is she ever quiet!

Thanks genetlemen for sharing your insights, and sorry for the delay weather stopped me from being able to test and report!

contents:
mks92a+ cyclic
TGY 306 Tail
AE45 esc
TGY 20A bec
Mini Vbar

I've set the cyclic gains on 54 as per other posts with the warp.

Tail end points as per the manual using the shortest arm of 8mm for the tail servo, based on other posts I had read about wagging.

I have a bad wag though, it only goes about 2-3" but its consistent. Gain through the Tx doesn't seem to help it only makes it more frequent or wider but slower.

I'm planning on trying the 12mm tail hole as per the manual and if that doesn't help I will pull out the boom a bit to increase tail belt tension... personally I suspect the tail belt is too lose as I set it based on feel of the blades rotating not the tension of the belt itself.

Any other issues you can suggest to look at would be greatly appreciated!

Thanks again!
-=S=-

[BaconRaygun]

12mm is too much, I think most people have it as around 8 or 9mm. I have it on the closest hole to center on the servo horns that came with my MKS servos.

For the wag, what tape are you using to mount your vbar?

I doubt it is tension...

Check for binding, snap the link off on the tail servo end and play with it. It should be completely resistance free... if it is not, check all links and size them. Also, the plastic insert on the tail bell-crank that the tail slider ball goes into, that may need to be sized. I had to on my warp, and my buddies warp also... this will cause binding. Use fine sand paper rolled into a tube to size this part.

[Scream]

Thanks for the heads up on the servo hole distance BaconRaygun! In preparation and while waiting for parts to arrive I read so much without doing that I remember the details but jumbled the why along the way.

I will stay on the shortest hole until all other possibilities are exhausted.

I think the idea of reaming the link holes is great, they are tight as heck and make the cyclics annoyingly loud, I have the tool so I will get on that asap!

I test hovered for 5 mins using a 2600 pulse but no canopy... bat came down @ 77% @70% ESC...omg this is gonna be epic once dialed in!!!!!

[BaconRaygun]

Yeh you definitely need to size all of the links, trust me, it makes a world of difference, especially for the tail.

[fjoe]

+1, Butter smooth tail!

[Scream]

Yup, made a big difference!

Tail holds tight, no drifting or wag now but it does get a bit skippy on pitch pumps, was working on the gains and then she fell out of the sky!! I landed her ok ish mostly freaked out by the tail stopping while I was still up... lost a few seconds tryin to figure out what I knew was supposed to happen on w360 auto

I didn't power cycle and after picking her up she spooled up again just fine so I'm thinking that either the esc doesn't like 70% without gov for 10 mins or perhaps I need to reconsider the "orange single satellite" situation and throw some dsmx on it.

Wish I had a spare port so I could use telemetry but atleast shes airborne!

[simplechamp]

Glad I caught this thread, building mine right now and assembled the tail servo horn last night with the ball at 12mm. Going to change to 8-9mm now.

Scream, what kind of values did you end up with for tail endpoints in the Mini Vbar when using 8-9mm? i.e. were they in the optimal 80-100 range as described in the Vstabi setup software or higher/lower?

[Scream]

Hey!

So I borrowed 2 dsmx sats while waiting on the new ones to show up... gains are now a lot easier since the value in the tx is the value in question!

My tail end points are 84/84 but my servo arm is not exactly 90 degrees, it points a bit towards the rear so I suspect that's the cause of the wag

I am about to tak another test flight, can update later on!

[Scream]

Hi Again!

So I wasn't able to get the servo horn any straighter due to the splines... decided to try and adjust the length of the pushrod. Luckily I didn't glue the end caps as per the manual incase I needed to fine tune!

She hold perfectly straight now in a hover, and shes nice and smooth on banked turns! On pitch pumps she wags and its a little bit more noticeably on decent. I don't have gov and haven't tried full 100% throttle as a sudden darkness and the smell of a thunderstorm caused me to bail prematurely on todays test round but I did notice that the wag effect on pitch pumps was less at higher throttle.

I'm not a hard 3d flyer and wasn't expecting to need full 100% TC. What is the best way to correct this? Are the main rotor gains somehow involved? Should I just lower the total pitch to limit this effect?

Any vbar uses with insights would be really helpful!

As luck would have it my hawk-RC canopy pins just arrived! Heli-gods are smiling on me!!!

Thanks in advance!!
-=S=-

[simplechamp]

Is the tail wagging multiple times during hard pitch inputs, or just pushing out a few inches then coming back into position?

May need to adjust the collective precompensation in the advanced tail parameters (only available in pro software). If the tail is overcompensating on hard pitch inputs (tail gets pushed left) then reduce the value. If it is undercompensating (tail gets pushed right) increase the value.

[Scream]

It goes 2-4 wags and then settles back down on pitch pumps only, even at 100%TC. The range of the wag is less on the way up.

Backwards flight is ok, but anytime I smack the blades, wag.