So how many ICE2 ESCs have burnt up since the recall?

[GB ian]

As it says..how many ICE2 ESCs have burnt up?

I think I have only seen one report so far.

It would be interesting to keep track of this. Like everyone with Castle ESCs I am nervous. But if the reality is that only 1 or 2 have flamed out maybe they have the problem solved...or maybe I have missed a bunch of reports and nothing is solved.

[Cailid]

I've seen at least 3 reports of them burning up so far. There will probably be more since quite a few people haven't even got theirs back yet.

[dunkonu23]

I've heard of five. Given there's more than 10,000 of them out there, That's at least a failure rate of .05 percent. That's not too shabby. Of course, if it happens to you, no stats matter.

Scoltt

[GB ian]

It would be really appropriate at this point for CC to share real data with us. If the failiure rate is known based on real data from the manufacturer they would help to rebuild their reputation.

I don't think anyyone is expecting zero failiures, assuuming there are 10000+ units.

But as we have no data from CC on how many units there actually are who knows what's going on.

[Chris_M]

Whats really funny is how CC says there OCP is on point with YGE and Kontronik. Thankfully there are more esc choices now then there used to be and even more coming soon where we dont have to depend on Castle for a lower cost alternative. They are going to wind up driving the HV line into the ground.

[dunkonu23]

I'm basing that 10,000 plus figure on what I've read from a Castle employee on another forum. Failures I'm basing on what I've read on every Castle thread I can find. I've got skin in this game times 2 so peace of mind is important.

Scott

[WBFAir]

First of all, 10,000 original ICE's out there being used is pretty much a joke.

The 120 came out in July of 2010, and they started burning by the fall of that same year and by about mid spring of 2011 when they were still burning, is when they came up with that number and ever since everyone just like so many do just follow anything Castle says like sheep and just accepted it with no proof of it even being a true number other then Castle saying it was, and so that is what spread and what has been just accepted as the number.

Now if you go through the math on that, (which I have done in the past but not going to go into the length of that now) roughly for the time they starting claiming that.... that would mean they would have had to sell like 25-30 ESC's everyday since it was introduced.

Thats EVERYDAY for like 8 months....and you believe that?

Now so then you say, well there were other ICEs' an those had been out longer and that's what they meant, but those weren't the ones that were burning so why include those and they were certainly weren't implying that with that statement at all as for every time I read that, they never said that number was for all the ICES and was always in a reply to the ratio of failures in regards to a 120 post, nor were the recalls to replace those others either until the very last one like 5 months later.

So why don't they just give us the numbers for the 80, or 120's or 160's that had been sold as those were the ones that were burning so that we could have a honest comparison to how many were made that burned?

Reason being is simple as since those were burning every other day with especially the 120's being like 85% of those, with so many fewer of those being made even if that 10,000 was close, they couldn't sit there and say their failure rate ratio was so incredibly low as it wouldn't have worked out that way.

But instead as it made them not look as bad, they gave that number.

Also of even those numbers, yeah, that's how many you made, but how many are/were just sitting in Align kit boxes and or on the shelves of someones LHS or the warehouse of distributor that for sure would burn but just are not being used? Nor ever will be.

So then factor that into the failure ratio rate.

All in all I know there are a few points that could be argued here but the bottom line is that them talking about a number of 10,000 in compare to how many have actually failed in a way of saying that is very low as compared to that number is just another BS scam of theirs to try to minimize our view of what they did.

Then one last other point is, for sure they haven't replaced 10,000 ESC's, nor have produce and gotten into use 10,000 new ones, and as well the season is pretty much over so for even the ones that have been replaced, its not like many of them are even being used right now.

For sure not till next year will we see if this fix is worth all that they claim.

Personally its probably the best one they have done to fix this problem yet as it showed real promise during the short time it was used, but as it has been said, still some of even those are burning and I would suspect you will start to see more reports of that happening in the spring.

But really what was, and still is, one of the biggest problems with all this is still broken and that is Castles attitude. As for all of this, (with this clam of 10,000 being a good example) I still don't see that getting fixed at all as for another example, right towards the end of the season their 100LV units were burning and again, they went right back into the BS of blaming the customer for bad installs or saying their batteries were old.

So point being, for what ever happens in the future, the problems that really caused this will mostly likely continue just as much as it did.

[dunkonu23]

WBFAir,

I'm not going to get in it with you. If I recollect properly, you don't have a Castle ESC anymore. While you're free to do as you wish, what you're really doing here is trolling.

Scott

[WBFAir]

Actually I still have one Castle product.

So what...does that now all of a sudden qualify me to be allowed to set the records straight when others are twisting truth's around?

Or are we only allowed to do that so long as we own a product or affected by its problems.

Coming on and setting the records straight when others don't like that isn't trolling.

All that is, is just passing on info that you know so that others know the truth so they don't get burned or mislead.

Its actually the cornerstone of one of the whole points of what these boards are for.

And you aren't only allowed to do that so long as you own a part, in fact gaining the knowledge of a bad part or company to deal with from an others past experience who has the brains enough to get rid of it or not deal with that company anymore when they know enough about it or them as a bad thing I think is one of the best people qualified to speak about the topic.

Certainly isn't one of the fan boys or people who just want to see that all swept under the table for their own personal benefits, especially when that is at the expense of others who don't know all the truths.

So don't know what else to tell you but if you disagree so much why don't you jump over the venders sections and start calling all the people who got hosed by all the bad venders over there and check to see if those people who post things are still owners of those parts and if not, call them troll's.

[GB ian]

I can see sales of 20 to 30 escs per day from CC, in fact I would assume that they sell more than that to be able to stay in business. 30 escs at $200 each is only $6000 which would not cover the daily cost of employing very people at all, unless CC is a three person operation, which I doubt!

BUT..the lack of info is the issue here. CC have everything to prove here, their reputation is in tatters. Yet something makes me think that CC thinks that it has nothing to prove.

[WBFAir]

Originally Posted by GB ian

I can see sales of 20 to 30 escs per day from CC, in fact I would assume that they sell more than that to be able to stay in business. 30 escs at $200 each is only $6000 which would not cover the daily cost of employing very people at all, unless CC is a three person operation, which I doubt!

Well I know you must know this and I'm not trying for this to come off as smart aleck as this sounds but they do sell things other then just the ICE line of ESC's

They have a several lines in the air series including several accessories for those. Then they have a whole other world we never hear of in the R/C car an boat field. Then they have motors and receivers and BEC's and even bullets and a few other things

So it's hardly like this one line of ESC's or 10,000 @ 20-30 a day is for sure what they did as that is what is needed to pay all the bills of keeping the company afloat.

Heck you could even run that backwards and say that since they have had to replace so many ICE's, if that really were so much of what they do, then considering the lost that would be, they would have had to fold up everything.

But their chugging alone just fine and continuing to get all their reps to all the shows they had scheduled and have the time to post to RCG and all kinds of stuff.

Heck even though they are still working on getting people their replacements, their already talking about that they've been working on the next release of software to work with the V-bar Gov, as well I read that they are even in the market for another electrical engineer.

Also keep in mind in regards to how many people they employ, that Castle themselves doesn't make much if anything at all, they sub that stuff out, even their bullets which I recently read that from them having issues with those and of course, they blamed it on those making them for them. And yeah they have to pay those guys but that's why they do this as those people, especially over in Asia work pretty darn cheap.

Originally Posted by GB ian

BUT..the lack of info is the issue here. CC have everything to prove here, their reputation is in tatters. Yet something makes me think that CC thinks that it has nothing to prove.

Pretty much got that right, but if you had the blind following they have wouldn't you feel the same.

Like I said and I think even you are saying, the mechanics of the ESC maybe be fixed but their attitude from all that I've seen hasn't changed one little bit and that really is/was the heart of the problem.

And as well with that, if they are going to look to get all the great profits they get from subbing everything out, they really need to figure out how to monitor what those sub's are doing and be on top of that the very second that has a problem instead of just dragging their feet for so long.

[dunkonu23]

WBFAir,

This is going to be my last reply in this thread because frankly, it is not worth my time. I wrote you are free to do as you wish. I meant exactly that, so please do not twist what I write to make a point that you have beaten to death elsewhere then disguise it as trying to inform others. You know nothing more about the situation with failure data than anyone else outside of Castle knows. I posted failure data that I found through searches. I posted a sales figure that Castle chose to make public. If you do not believe it, fine; I do not care.

If you read between the lines of the ICE2 failure threads, you might come to the conclusion that Castle is doing something with those who have had ICE2 failures. Then again, you might also come to the conclusion that those with failures have been ignored. Your choice. Perception is reality.

If you perceive Castle as an evil empire, so be it. I am pretty sure nobody can convince you otherwise. I know I will not be trying.

Scott

[WBFAir]

Originally Posted by dunkonu23

WBFAir,

This is going to be my last reply in this thread because frankly, it is not worth my time. I wrote you are free to do as you wish. I meant exactly that, so please do not twist what I write to make a point that you have beaten to death elsewhere then disguise it as trying to inform others. You know nothing more about the situation with failure data than anyone else outside of Castle knows. I posted failure data that I found through searches. I posted a sales figure that Castle chose to make public. If you do not believe it, fine; I do not care.

If you read between the lines of the ICE2 failure threads, you might come to the conclusion that Castle is doing something with those who have had ICE2 failures. Then again, you might also come to the conclusion that those with failures have been ignored. Your choice. Perception is reality.

If you perceive Castle as an evil empire, so be it. I am pretty sure nobody can convince you otherwise. I know I will not be trying.

Scott

Not really much to reply to there, as not saying much really.

About the only thing I will say is that while of course I and no one else could possibly know more then what Castle has allowed us to know (how could we), but that for every post I make, I very much go to great lengths and really make sure to double and triple check every fact I can. And have even had to change things in them as I was writing them if I found out I was wrong.

The bottom line its that I know for sure (even when I am writing the post) that for all the ones out there that will read and then take the time to reply to anything I say that when I say the things like I am saying about Castle...I know for sure that there are going to be 10 times more ones who are going see it as a threat for them and thus try to challenge anything I say.

Unfortunately the last thing in the world many people want to is deal with are things where they feel like they want to believe something is some way when its not. And also 90% of the time, especially when you see that go hard core, you find that is actually driven by things far other then the facts.

More often its things like, feeling like it's a personal attack against their intelligence to make the right decision on what to buy.

Many times its rooted in the fact that the manufacture makes a product that is cheaper then anyone else's but still has lots of features or has some other specific thing to it that is really something alone that matters to them. So what they worry about is that if others start reading things about it that they know will cause them not to buy it, this will mean the company will sell less of them, and then they may either might stop making the product, or not put much money into its advancement. And so for them the see this as a threat personally and they don't even care about what is true or not or what other people would have to deal with with all those shortcomings as they just see it as a threat for them.

Or then there are times where you find that the person actually have some personal interests in it like they might own a LHS or who have ones that they really like and feel then need to support them by helping their sales anyway they can, and or might be involved in something that has some other profit related relationship.

And I could go on as to other reasons but the point is, I already know when I am writing it that you rarely are you going to be getting apposing responses that really have anything to do with what they are actually writing.

So as I have dealt with this for many hobbies and other things on post boards, I have learned two things in that when you say things like this, you better be 110% accurate, and 110% objective in regards to the facts you present.

And even more simply put, heck who even needs to harshly interpret what has happened here. I mean tons of ESC's have burned and through revision after revision and there's no denying that. Castle has been proven to have been either flat out lying about many things, and or has shown a history of denying things or playing games with things like calling this ESC the ICE2 when it is really about the 5th revision to this problem. And as well not only is it undeniable that this all this and more has happened, but with just a quick run over to their section at RCG, it is shown that they are continuing with the same old junk that got them (and us) into all the mess in the first place with any new problems.

And with all that has happened and with so much of it being documented all you have to do is go back gather all the info and publish it.

For example, I saw a thread about a month ago where people were asking which revision the ICE2 was as with it being called the ICE2, they were confused (which is precisely what Castle was hoping for). So after seeing the discussion go on for a bit where, and without valiciousness, people where getting things wrong and were continuing to be confused, I finally went back to all of Castle listed info on their own site as to all the dates and revisions and used those specifically and with links to them and used that along with all the info I had come to know from my personal interactions with things, and wrote a long post on each revision and as to why it came about. And naturally even with all of that of course some got bent about it.

But the bottom line for me is that is how I write stuff and if ever I put in my own personal opinions, and or something that cannot be 110% proven, I always say that it comes from that.

Simply put at the end of the day, I see myself and us as people who need to look out for each other as for sure a company like Castle surly isn't. So if we don't, who will?

But like said, and for the reasons I listed about, there are some who don't work that way and who come to these boards with all those issues and will say things that they want to believe are true because of many of those factors and so if I happened to read them and feel like setting the record straight, then like I said in the other post, that is what I feel is one of the biggest things these boards are for as I think we all have a bit of a responsibility to look out for each other if we can.

And if you don't think I'm right, then take what I've said and research it and if you feel I'm wrong and want to choose other wise, then that's your choice and in doing so you are only hurting yourself. But so long as others are going to then take the extra step and come here and publish things that are not true and especially do that for the reasons like I posted about, then you are typically you are always going to get a guy like me who is going to chime in and post about that.

[kcordell]

Note: Heli guys aren't the only ones using these ESC's out there and not only in the US. The 10K number could be a very good one or even low.

[GB ian]

It would be helpful if we could try to stick to the point of the thread.

[mkdive]

[GB ian]

I am guessing then that there aren't that many burnt up. My own 80HV is running well, in fact the heli seems to be drawing less power for the same flight times as before. This might just be my imagination, but my packs used to come down nice and hot, in fact i was running them a bit too hard. Now they are just warm.

[Cailid]

From the sounds of things most people are still waiting to get their new esc. Should ask this again when CC gets around to replacing all of them. Next october maybe?

[dunkonu23]

Make that six...

https://www.helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=363397

Scott

[Cailid]

Add another 15 to that.

https://www.helifreak.com/showpost.p...92&postcount=6