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xcraftllc · 07-17-2009, 05:49 AM

Ok, I know next to nothing about SJM helis, other than I like the design philosophy: Absolute minimalism. But how do you experienced pilots who have flown a lot of different brands like it? I mean, how does the design philosophy compare to other, more mainstream designs like Miniature Aircraft, Outrage, NextD, and Align?
I'm sure this question has been asked and answered many times before, so excuse the redundancy!

J-S-Q · 07-20-2009, 03:32 AM

I used to have an SJM430 and compared to the Aligns that I have (250, 450, 500 & 600N) I felt that SJM were much more focused on innovation and originality which I think is a great thing. However I think the down side is that they change the design too often and don't always refine and perfect it enough which means they are much less forgiving when it comes to set up and somewhat less reliable in my experience.

Far more than half the times I took my 430 to the field there would be some kind of problem with it where as with my Aligns it's more like 1 time in 100 there is a problem. I also found occasional problems with parts quality/tolerances which I haven't experienced with Align. In the end that's why I sold my SJM -it was just frustrating and costing me too much in repairing the problems (would have been a lot cheaper if there was a UK supplier).

I kind of feel that the new SJM430E3 is an example of the problem with SJM's philosophy -instead of taking the previous version of the 430 and ironing out some of the problems with it, they have virtually redesigned it from the ground up with a completely different frame design which will likely have various entirely different issues than the previous version -so is it really going to be a step forward or is it just going to be different for the sake of being different?

If you have the time/skill/resources/patience then I still think they are potentially great helis but don't expect it to be anywhere near as easy as buying something like an Align.

airborne1112003 · 07-27-2009, 04:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by J-S-Q

I used to have an SJM430 and compared to the Aligns that I have (250, 450, 500 & 600N) I felt that SJM were much more focused on innovation and originality which I think is a great thing. However I think the down side is that they change the design too often and don't always refine and perfect it enough which means they are much less forgiving when it comes to set up and somewhat less reliable in my experience.

Far more than half the times I took my 430 to the field there would be some kind of problem with it where as with my Aligns it's more like 1 time in 100 there is a problem. I also found occasional problems with parts quality/tolerances which I haven't experienced with Align. In the end that's why I sold my SJM -it was just frustrating and costing me too much in repairing the problems (would have been a lot cheaper if there was a UK supplier).

I kind of feel that the new SJM430E3 is an example of the problem with SJM's philosophy -instead of taking the previous version of the 430 and ironing out some of the problems with it, they have virtually redesigned it from the ground up with a completely different frame design which will likely have various entirely different issues than the previous version -so is it really going to be a step forward or is it just going to be different for the sake of being different?

If you have the time/skill/resources/patience then I still think they are potentially great helis but don't expect it to be anywhere near as easy as buying something like an Align.

+1

mguw · 07-28-2009, 04:29 AM

Hi

you are right, an SJM requires a lot of dedication to have it running smoothly. Mainly because of the overall rigidity that turns the slightest imbalance to huge vibrations. Not taking cares of those ruins everything.

Said that, My SJM430 has now 350+ flights and not much wear. I have just changed a couple of ball bearings and ball links after crashes.

Fact is that it is the Helicopter that I enjoy most flying. No other even come close in terms of crispness (no head dampening) speed and power. My comparison is ( protos,TREX500, LOGO600 and even Three Dee MP-E (next best). From all these the SJM remains most fun at the sticks! And that is worth to me the dedication in fine tunning the beast.

here a speed video of mine http://www.rcmovie.de/video/bc397017...raining-148kmh
and some nice rainbows at the end http://www.rcmovie.de/video/c6e4b765...-landet-mann-?

regards

Marcel

Scott_RC-TEK · 07-31-2009, 12:39 AM

FYI:
You can update the SJM430 E2 with many of the upgrades we have been working on for the E3.

Swash
Hub
Feathering bolts
Blade grips
Flybar stand
Flybar rod
Tail housing

Regards,
Scott

Nexus665 · 07-31-2009, 06:47 AM

Hi,

I'm going to put a few pictures and maybe a video together this weekend about upgrading an E2 revision heli with E3 parts (or go from V2.5 to V2.6, depending on nomenclature, that's what it's called here in Europe) - though not an E2 model from RC-Tek/Scott, mine's pretty much identical, but bought in Germany.

There are a few caveats and slight modifications necessary when doing so, but overall it's well worth the upgrade IMO.

I'll post a link here and put it on RCGroups, probably.

Regards,
Simon.

07-17-2009, 05:49 AM	#1 (permalink)
xcraftllc Registered Users Join Date: Mar 2008	SJM Design philosophy review Ok, I know next to nothing about SJM helis, other than I like the design philosophy: Absolute minimalism. But how do you experienced pilots who have flown a lot of different brands like it? I mean, how does the design philosophy compare to other, more mainstream designs like Miniature Aircraft, Outrage, NextD, and Align? I'm sure this question has been asked and answered many times before, so excuse the redundancy! __________________ AH-64D

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07-20-2009, 03:32 AM	#2 (permalink)
J-S-Q Registered Users Join Date: Apr 2008	I used to have an SJM430 and compared to the Aligns that I have (250, 450, 500 & 600N) I felt that SJM were much more focused on innovation and originality which I think is a great thing. However I think the down side is that they change the design too often and don't always refine and perfect it enough which means they are much less forgiving when it comes to set up and somewhat less reliable in my experience. Far more than half the times I took my 430 to the field there would be some kind of problem with it where as with my Aligns it's more like 1 time in 100 there is a problem. I also found occasional problems with parts quality/tolerances which I haven't experienced with Align. In the end that's why I sold my SJM -it was just frustrating and costing me too much in repairing the problems (would have been a lot cheaper if there was a UK supplier). I kind of feel that the new SJM430E3 is an example of the problem with SJM's philosophy -instead of taking the previous version of the 430 and ironing out some of the problems with it, they have virtually redesigned it from the ground up with a completely different frame design which will likely have various entirely different issues than the previous version -so is it really going to be a step forward or is it just going to be different for the sake of being different? If you have the time/skill/resources/patience then I still think they are potentially great helis but don't expect it to be anywhere near as easy as buying something like an Align.

07-28-2009, 04:29 AM	#4 (permalink)
mguw Registered Users Join Date: Jul 2007	Hi you are right, an SJM requires a lot of dedication to have it running smoothly. Mainly because of the overall rigidity that turns the slightest imbalance to huge vibrations. Not taking cares of those ruins everything. Said that, My SJM430 has now 350+ flights and not much wear. I have just changed a couple of ball bearings and ball links after crashes. Fact is that it is the Helicopter that I enjoy most flying. No other even come close in terms of crispness (no head dampening) speed and power. My comparison is ( protos,TREX500, LOGO600 and even Three Dee MP-E (next best). From all these the SJM remains most fun at the sticks! And that is worth to me the dedication in fine tunning the beast. here a speed video of mine http://www.rcmovie.de/video/bc397017...raining-148kmh and some nice rainbows at the end http://www.rcmovie.de/video/c6e4b765...-landet-mann-? regards Marcel

07-31-2009, 12:39 AM	#5 (permalink)
Scott_RC-TEK Registered Users Join Date: Sep 2006	FYI: You can update the SJM430 E2 with many of the upgrades we have been working on for the E3. Swash Hub Feathering bolts Blade grips Flybar stand Flybar rod Tail housing Regards, Scott

07-31-2009, 06:47 AM	#6 (permalink)
Nexus665 Registered Users Join Date: Feb 2009	Hi, I'm going to put a few pictures and maybe a video together this weekend about upgrading an E2 revision heli with E3 parts (or go from V2.5 to V2.6, depending on nomenclature, that's what it's called here in Europe) - though not an E2 model from RC-Tek/Scott, mine's pretty much identical, but bought in Germany. There are a few caveats and slight modifications necessary when doing so, but overall it's well worth the upgrade IMO. I'll post a link here and put it on RCGroups, probably. Regards, Simon.

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