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rc247 · 01-21-2015, 05:13 PM

I upgraded my motor to a Turnigy and now I don't get Idle up 2. Rebound Bx… no help.
Plug stock motor back and IU2 works…

Any ideas?

andycrazy · 01-22-2015, 06:11 AM

Could do with a little more info as to what esc you are using, any governor, throttle curves. Is the Turnigy too much for the esc you are using?

rc247 · 01-22-2015, 10:39 AM

Stock ESC… I think the motor is 3800kv so don't think it's too much for ESC… IDK?

I just plug n played the motor

Nelsonisms · 01-22-2015, 11:15 AM

The KV just means the number of revolutions per volt. It has little to do with the ESC other than the fact that you must gear it to keep the headspeed in a reasonable range. The more important part is the amperage it draws and, by virtue, the wattage it generates.

But the whole idea of IU1 or IU2 is just a configuration in your transmitter. It has little to do with the motor itself. If you're saying that the speed doesn't change between the two then it more than likely has to do with the actual throttle values you've specified and/or your throttle endpoints in the transmitter. It's a well known fact that EFlite ESCs have a deadband above 80% if the endpoints are not calibrated in the transmitter. So anything above 80% is basically the same as 100%. For anyone to be able to help you further they'll need to know some more specific information.

Specific model # of the motor (to make sure it's not pulling more than 35A)
The # of teeth on the pinion and main gear (to estimate headspeed)
Your transmitter's throttle curve configuration for all flight modes. (to understand the difference between your IU1 and IU2 settings)
Your transmitter's throttle endpoint configured values. (to understand if it's a deadband issue or not)

andycrazy · 01-23-2015, 08:44 AM

Also it would be useful to know what exactly is or is not happening when you go into IU2. IE is it as Nelsonisms suggests your headspeed does not increase? Does your motor stop (highly unlikely but just included to give an idea of the sort of info we need). If you let us know anything that you notice the heli does when IU2 is activated (no matter how small or trivial you think it is) it would help point people in the direction of a cure.

rc247 · 01-23-2015, 09:55 AM

-It's this motor;http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...50_class_.html
-12 tooth pinion
-Throttle curve is flat 80 in IU1. Flat 90 in IU2
No response in IU2. Only when I switch to IU1. When I switch to IU2 it stays at the same head speed.
When I look at the indication on my Tx (dx7) it shows that the throttle jumps up when switched.
It's a good motor... Had it in my other helis (with Align 35a ESC) with no problems... (Wish I didn't sell it...)

NewToRC · 01-23-2015, 10:15 AM

I just put the Turnigy 2218H in my Blade 450 3D to replace my last 440 motor. When I switch into IU1, I can barely tell a difference in headspeed either. My settings go from about 75% in standard mode to IU1 at 100%. It definitely has less power than the 440 but I don't have to worry about the bearings anymore. Since I'm starting my Forza build I'm not too worried about it. If I plan on keeping the Blade I will just get an 11 tooth pinion. I look forward to seeing what you find out.

rc247 · 01-23-2015, 10:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NewToRC

I just put the Turnigy 2218H in my Blade 450 3D to replace my last 440 motor. When I switch into IU1, I can barely tell a difference in headspeed either. My settings go from about 75% in standard mode to IU1 at 100%. It definitely has less power than the 440 but I don't have to worry about the bearings anymore. Since I'm starting my Forza build I'm not too worried about it. If I plan on keeping the Blade I will just get an 11 tooth pinion. I look forward to seeing what you find out.

Hummm....

gstoneberg · 01-23-2015, 11:42 AM

I also put a 2218 in my FBL blade400 and it bogs badly with a 12t pinion. It is much quieter than the 420 stock motor tho so I actually can hear blade noise that I've never heard before with a 450. I'm going to swap it with a 2215 and see if that works better while I wait for the 11t pinion I ordered.

Flipwit · 01-23-2015, 12:31 PM

I can't find the thread but I remember reading somewhere that the way the stock ESC is programmed, 86% throttle via the radio is actually treated as 100% throttle on the stock esc due to how it receives commands from the AR7200BX, among other limitations of the stock ESC. I think this is due to the stock ESC not really having programmable throttle end points. Maybe try picking up a better after market ESC that can program throttle end points and report back?

Edit, found the link:

https://www.helifreak.com/archive/in.../t-489792.html

andycrazy · 01-23-2015, 02:19 PM

Unfortunately it is the deadband that Nelsonisms mentioned in his post that is causing the problem. 80% (or thereabouts) is full throttle on the stock esc. You will not get the motor to spin any faster than it does at 80% throttle.

If you want a lower Throttle Curve for IU1 you could try around 55-60% (this should get an equivalent of around 80% if you had full throttle at 100% TC) and have IU2 set to 80-85% (this is equivalent to 100% if you had full throttle at 100%TC).

The link Flipwit provides explains this.

rc247 · 01-23-2015, 05:00 PM

Makes sense... Thanks guys

01-21-2015, 05:13 PM	#1 (permalink)
rc247 Registered Users Join Date: Jan 2009	Upgraded motor now no IU2... I upgraded my motor to a Turnigy and now I don't get Idle up 2. Rebound Bx… no help. Plug stock motor back and IU2 works… Any ideas? __________________ I love gyros!!! They're yummy!!!

01-22-2015, 06:11 AM	#2 (permalink)
andycrazy Registered Users Join Date: Jan 2014	Could do with a little more info as to what esc you are using, any governor, throttle curves. Is the Turnigy too much for the esc you are using? __________________ Blade 450X - Savox, Scorp 2221-8 13t Slant Edge Lite50 Blade 450X (3D) - Hitech Servs Std ESC and 420 Motor Blade 300X - Savox Servos, lynx tail, OWB, Talon 35, Hyperion 2213 3585 14t std main, DX6

01-22-2015, 10:39 AM	#3 (permalink)
rc247 Registered Users Thread Starter Join Date: Jan 2009	Stock ESC… I think the motor is 3800kv so don't think it's too much for ESC… IDK? I just plug n played the motor __________________ I love gyros!!! They're yummy!!!

01-22-2015, 11:15 AM	#4 (permalink)
Nelsonisms HF Support Join Date: Feb 2013	The KV just means the number of revolutions per volt. It has little to do with the ESC other than the fact that you must gear it to keep the headspeed in a reasonable range. The more important part is the amperage it draws and, by virtue, the wattage it generates. But the whole idea of IU1 or IU2 is just a configuration in your transmitter. It has little to do with the motor itself. If you're saying that the speed doesn't change between the two then it more than likely has to do with the actual throttle values you've specified and/or your throttle endpoints in the transmitter. It's a well known fact that EFlite ESCs have a deadband above 80% if the endpoints are not calibrated in the transmitter. So anything above 80% is basically the same as 100%. For anyone to be able to help you further they'll need to know some more specific information. Specific model # of the motor (to make sure it's not pulling more than 35A) The # of teeth on the pinion and main gear (to estimate headspeed) Your transmitter's throttle curve configuration for all flight modes. (to understand the difference between your IU1 and IU2 settings) Your transmitter's throttle endpoint configured values. (to understand if it's a deadband issue or not) __________________ Gaui X5F 6S (VBar), Lynx 450X-L 6S (Ikon), Lynx 300X-L 4S (Ikon), Blade 180CFX 3S (Ikon) Lumenier QAV400 4S (Vector), Lumenier QAV250 3S (Naze32/CleanFlight), CYE Stingray 500 4S (TG Multi) AMA Member, HCAM Member

01-23-2015, 08:44 AM	#5 (permalink)
andycrazy Registered Users Join Date: Jan 2014	Also it would be useful to know what exactly is or is not happening when you go into IU2. IE is it as Nelsonisms suggests your headspeed does not increase? Does your motor stop (highly unlikely but just included to give an idea of the sort of info we need). If you let us know anything that you notice the heli does when IU2 is activated (no matter how small or trivial you think it is) it would help point people in the direction of a cure. __________________ Blade 450X - Savox, Scorp 2221-8 13t Slant Edge Lite50 Blade 450X (3D) - Hitech Servs Std ESC and 420 Motor Blade 300X - Savox Servos, lynx tail, OWB, Talon 35, Hyperion 2213 3585 14t std main, DX6

01-23-2015, 09:55 AM	#6 (permalink)
rc247 Registered Users Thread Starter Join Date: Jan 2009	-It's this motor;http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/s...50_class_.html -12 tooth pinion -Throttle curve is flat 80 in IU1. Flat 90 in IU2 No response in IU2. Only when I switch to IU1. When I switch to IU2 it stays at the same head speed. When I look at the indication on my Tx (dx7) it shows that the throttle jumps up when switched. It's a good motor... Had it in my other helis (with Align 35a ESC) with no problems... (Wish I didn't sell it...) __________________ I love gyros!!! They're yummy!!!

01-23-2015, 10:15 AM	#7 (permalink)
NewToRC Registered Users My HF Map location Join Date: Dec 2009	I just put the Turnigy 2218H in my Blade 450 3D to replace my last 440 motor. When I switch into IU1, I can barely tell a difference in headspeed either. My settings go from about 75% in standard mode to IU1 at 100%. It definitely has less power than the 440 but I don't have to worry about the bearings anymore. Since I'm starting my Forza build I'm not too worried about it. If I plan on keeping the Blade I will just get an 11 tooth pinion. I look forward to seeing what you find out.

01-23-2015, 11:42 AM	#9 (permalink)
gstoneberg Registered Users My HF Map location Join Date: Feb 2013	I also put a 2218 in my FBL blade400 and it bogs badly with a 12t pinion. It is much quieter than the 420 stock motor tho so I actually can hear blade noise that I've never heard before with a 450. I'm going to swap it with a 2215 and see if that works better while I wait for the 11t pinion I ordered. __________________ George - Goblin700(iKon2), Trex550e(iKon), Oxy3(microiKon), Taranis

01-23-2015, 12:31 PM	#10 (permalink)
Flipwit Registered Users Join Date: May 2012	I can't find the thread but I remember reading somewhere that the way the stock ESC is programmed, 86% throttle via the radio is actually treated as 100% throttle on the stock esc due to how it receives commands from the AR7200BX, among other limitations of the stock ESC. I think this is due to the stock ESC not really having programmable throttle end points. Maybe try picking up a better after market ESC that can program throttle end points and report back? Edit, found the link: https://www.helifreak.com/archive/in.../t-489792.html Last edited by Flipwit; 01-23-2015 at 12:32 PM.. Reason: Found the link!

01-23-2015, 02:19 PM	#11 (permalink)
andycrazy Registered Users Join Date: Jan 2014	Unfortunately it is the deadband that Nelsonisms mentioned in his post that is causing the problem. 80% (or thereabouts) is full throttle on the stock esc. You will not get the motor to spin any faster than it does at 80% throttle. If you want a lower Throttle Curve for IU1 you could try around 55-60% (this should get an equivalent of around 80% if you had full throttle at 100% TC) and have IU2 set to 80-85% (this is equivalent to 100% if you had full throttle at 100%TC). The link Flipwit provides explains this. __________________ Blade 450X - Savox, Scorp 2221-8 13t Slant Edge Lite50 Blade 450X (3D) - Hitech Servs Std ESC and 420 Motor Blade 300X - Savox Servos, lynx tail, OWB, Talon 35, Hyperion 2213 3585 14t std main, DX6

01-23-2015, 05:00 PM	#12 (permalink)
rc247 Registered Users Thread Starter Join Date: Jan 2009	Makes sense... Thanks guys __________________ I love gyros!!! They're yummy!!!

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