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Morne1312 · 10-11-2011, 02:26 AM

Hi Guys.

Hope someone can help me that has had this problem before, or has a lot more knowledge than me, a first time flier.

I Bought a Lama V4 about a week back, being very interested in RC Helicopter flying.
I made a few crash landings and decided to buy the upgrade parts for personal pride in Helicopter and also not wanting to replace the parts everytime the heli comes down.
I replaced the main drive shaft, collets ass well as the bottom rotor and collets but could not get hold of the swashplate upgrade as all shops i tried did not have them in stock but all assured me that the plastic one wil also work with the upgraded parts. all have been changed and seem to be working well but the problem i have is that the helli does not have that much lift as the blades are out of track and there is a lot of vibration coming from the main drive shaft rotor on top because of the blade tracking that i cant seem to get corrected. Please, any help would be appreciated

AndrejaKo · 10-11-2011, 11:32 AM

First step is to actually read some threads about upgrades BEFORE upgrading. If you did that, you'd have known that you should only upgrade ONE part at a time! This helps minimize sources of problems, because RC helicopters are pretty complex.

Now, we need to separate this problem into several problems.

First, I'll interpret your description of upgraded parts to mean following (do write it down more clearly, if I'm mistaken):

1. metal upper blade grip
2. metal bottom blade grip
3. main gear B and main shaft A (the outer shaft)
4. set of "B" blades

So for the first part: The metal blade grips on these helicopters according to numerous posts I've read are worse than plastic grips and are to be avoided. Try switching to plastic grips, if you have them for troubleshooting purposes. We'll see later if the grips are the main source of the problems.

Next, it's generally recommended to have top and bottom blades of the same type, so if you used a different type of blades for the "B" set, try matching the blade types on "A" and "B" sets.

Next, let's take a look at the shaft. You said you changed the main shaft A (outer shaft). Are you sure that only it has been damaged? Damage to it is usually from bending and the main shaft B (inner shaft) is usually damaged with it too. The B gear could also be damaged.

To test this, remove the blade grips, flybar and airframe. Then connect the battery and slowly increase throttle. Keep looking at the gears for now. When they start slowly turning, watch them. If they aren't rotating in parallel planes, then you have gear trouble which can later lead to motor trouble. Damaged gears usually have to be replaced. Also check that the pinion gears on motors are meshing correctly with main gears. Since main gears are thinner than pinion gears, they should completely mesh with the pinions. If there's a part of main gear which is above of below a pinion, then the pinion may need to be moved a bit. After that increase throttle to say 50% and look at the center hub B (on the outer shaft) and center hub A (on the inner shaft). As you increase throttle, they should keep making nice and clean rotations. You'll be able to see if something is off center and bent. Also watch for vibrations. If you get vibrations at this stage, then you know that the cause is in this part of the assembly.

Next we'll check the blade grips and blades. Take two glasses. Put the blades into grips and assemble grips as you would assemble them if they were on a shaft. Then put one grip and tighten the blades in such position that they are going straight out of the grip. Then put the grip in top of the glasses so that the ball links themselves are making contact with edges of the glasses. The idea is to see if the blades are properly balanced and if the grips themselves are holding the blades properly. n the stock blades, you'll see a flat part of the blade which is on the portion of the blade which goes into the grip. Grips should be holding blades in such way that the flat parts stand in same plane. If they aren't then you have bad grips. If the blades aren't properly balanced, try swapping them so that you find balanced pairs. If you can't do that, make pairs which are as close to perfectly balanced as possible and then search for balance guides (there are several good on this forum plus countless more on the Internet) and balance them.

Finally we have the stabilizer set adjustments. It consists of a flybar with two weights and two rubber weight holders, two control links and screw rod. First check that the flybar itself is straight by rolling it on a flat surface. Next, install the fuselage, blade grips and glades to the helicopter. After that install the stabilizer set, but do not connect the control link B to the ball link. Instead make sure that the blades are straight in the grips. Make sure that the A blade set in parallel to the B blade set. It won't be hard to set it to be so, if the blades go straight out of the grips. After that position the flybar in such way that it is in a plane parallel to the plane in which the A blades are. Then adjust the length of the flybar link by twisting the control links so that the B control link will make connection to the ball on the upped blade grip ball joint. Next step is to actually connect them. You may have to adjust the link length a bit after that in case something moved. This should make the flybar rotate correctly.

By now most causes of vibration should have been removed.

If the A blades do not track properly, you may try adjusting the flybar link on the stabilizer set so that the blades do track correctly.

The only adjustment for B blade set is to try to bend the blades a bit in order to track correctly.

Do note that the if the blade grips and shafts are fine, it is difficult to get blades on this helicopter type much out of track. Also it shouldn't lose much lift even if the blades are a bit out of track.

To me this whole thing looks like problems with blade grips, but I can't be sure form the description.

Also note that I used terminology used in the printed manual for Lama. For some components, there are other popular names too.

Do let us know what you've tried and what the results are.

bryont · 10-13-2011, 10:46 PM

I went through the same thing! I replaced mine all at once and it was such a pain that I put the heli away for a year or so. I just rebuilt the whole thing with Extreme parts.

One thing that did wrong one time is put the wrong blades on! Make sure you have the right blades on the right set of blade grips. Did that once and the heli won't have much lift!

Morne1312 · 10-16-2011, 11:39 PM

Thanks guys, i removed all upgrade parts and went back to standard plastic parts. The heli seems fine now, all vibrations gone and heli seems fine now. The only problem i have now is that the heli still does not have much lift, and when i turn with the one rotor turning slower than the other to initiate the turn, the heli loses the little lift that it had and drops to the ground?

AndrejaKo · 10-18-2011, 02:55 AM

This leads me to believe that one of the motors may be problematic. I had such problems right before one of my motors died.

10-11-2011, 02:26 AM	#1 (permalink)
Morne1312 Registered Users Join Date: Oct 2011	Lama V4 Problems After Upgrade Parts Hi Guys. Hope someone can help me that has had this problem before, or has a lot more knowledge than me, a first time flier. I Bought a Lama V4 about a week back, being very interested in RC Helicopter flying. I made a few crash landings and decided to buy the upgrade parts for personal pride in Helicopter and also not wanting to replace the parts everytime the heli comes down. I replaced the main drive shaft, collets ass well as the bottom rotor and collets but could not get hold of the swashplate upgrade as all shops i tried did not have them in stock but all assured me that the plastic one wil also work with the upgraded parts. all have been changed and seem to be working well but the problem i have is that the helli does not have that much lift as the blades are out of track and there is a lot of vibration coming from the main drive shaft rotor on top because of the blade tracking that i cant seem to get corrected. Please, any help would be appreciated

10-13-2011, 10:46 PM	#3 (permalink)
bryont Registered Users Join Date: Jul 2011	not much lift I went through the same thing! I replaced mine all at once and it was such a pain that I put the heli away for a year or so. I just rebuilt the whole thing with Extreme parts. One thing that did wrong one time is put the wrong blades on! Make sure you have the right blades on the right set of blade grips. Did that once and the heli won't have much lift!

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10-11-2011, 11:32 AM	#2 (permalink)
AndrejaKo Registered Users My HF Map location Join Date: Jun 2011	First step is to actually read some threads about upgrades BEFORE upgrading. If you did that, you'd have known that you should only upgrade ONE part at a time! This helps minimize sources of problems, because RC helicopters are pretty complex. Now, we need to separate this problem into several problems. First, I'll interpret your description of upgraded parts to mean following (do write it down more clearly, if I'm mistaken): 1. metal upper blade grip 2. metal bottom blade grip 3. main gear B and main shaft A (the outer shaft) 4. set of "B" blades So for the first part: The metal blade grips on these helicopters according to numerous posts I've read are worse than plastic grips and are to be avoided. Try switching to plastic grips, if you have them for troubleshooting purposes. We'll see later if the grips are the main source of the problems. Next, it's generally recommended to have top and bottom blades of the same type, so if you used a different type of blades for the "B" set, try matching the blade types on "A" and "B" sets. Next, let's take a look at the shaft. You said you changed the main shaft A (outer shaft). Are you sure that only it has been damaged? Damage to it is usually from bending and the main shaft B (inner shaft) is usually damaged with it too. The B gear could also be damaged. To test this, remove the blade grips, flybar and airframe. Then connect the battery and slowly increase throttle. Keep looking at the gears for now. When they start slowly turning, watch them. If they aren't rotating in parallel planes, then you have gear trouble which can later lead to motor trouble. Damaged gears usually have to be replaced. Also check that the pinion gears on motors are meshing correctly with main gears. Since main gears are thinner than pinion gears, they should completely mesh with the pinions. If there's a part of main gear which is above of below a pinion, then the pinion may need to be moved a bit. After that increase throttle to say 50% and look at the center hub B (on the outer shaft) and center hub A (on the inner shaft). As you increase throttle, they should keep making nice and clean rotations. You'll be able to see if something is off center and bent. Also watch for vibrations. If you get vibrations at this stage, then you know that the cause is in this part of the assembly. Next we'll check the blade grips and blades. Take two glasses. Put the blades into grips and assemble grips as you would assemble them if they were on a shaft. Then put one grip and tighten the blades in such position that they are going straight out of the grip. Then put the grip in top of the glasses so that the ball links themselves are making contact with edges of the glasses. The idea is to see if the blades are properly balanced and if the grips themselves are holding the blades properly. n the stock blades, you'll see a flat part of the blade which is on the portion of the blade which goes into the grip. Grips should be holding blades in such way that the flat parts stand in same plane. If they aren't then you have bad grips. If the blades aren't properly balanced, try swapping them so that you find balanced pairs. If you can't do that, make pairs which are as close to perfectly balanced as possible and then search for balance guides (there are several good on this forum plus countless more on the Internet) and balance them. Finally we have the stabilizer set adjustments. It consists of a flybar with two weights and two rubber weight holders, two control links and screw rod. First check that the flybar itself is straight by rolling it on a flat surface. Next, install the fuselage, blade grips and glades to the helicopter. After that install the stabilizer set, but do not connect the control link B to the ball link. Instead make sure that the blades are straight in the grips. Make sure that the A blade set in parallel to the B blade set. It won't be hard to set it to be so, if the blades go straight out of the grips. After that position the flybar in such way that it is in a plane parallel to the plane in which the A blades are. Then adjust the length of the flybar link by twisting the control links so that the B control link will make connection to the ball on the upped blade grip ball joint. Next step is to actually connect them. You may have to adjust the link length a bit after that in case something moved. This should make the flybar rotate correctly. By now most causes of vibration should have been removed. If the A blades do not track properly, you may try adjusting the flybar link on the stabilizer set so that the blades do track correctly. The only adjustment for B blade set is to try to bend the blades a bit in order to track correctly. Do note that the if the blade grips and shafts are fine, it is difficult to get blades on this helicopter type much out of track. Also it shouldn't lose much lift even if the blades are a bit out of track. To me this whole thing looks like problems with blade grips, but I can't be sure form the description. Also note that I used terminology used in the printed manual for Lama. For some components, there are other popular names too. Do let us know what you've tried and what the results are.

10-16-2011, 11:39 PM	#4 (permalink)
Morne1312 Registered Users Thread Starter Join Date: Oct 2011	Thanks guys, i removed all upgrade parts and went back to standard plastic parts. The heli seems fine now, all vibrations gone and heli seems fine now. The only problem i have now is that the heli still does not have much lift, and when i turn with the one rotor turning slower than the other to initiate the turn, the heli loses the little lift that it had and drops to the ground?

10-18-2011, 02:55 AM	#5 (permalink)
AndrejaKo Registered Users My HF Map location Join Date: Jun 2011	This leads me to believe that one of the motors may be problematic. I had such problems right before one of my motors died.

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