Issue with LYNX frame brace

[Centurian]

Originally Posted by nartac

I think "sh*t happens" sometimes, buddy. Perhaps you received dud pins/standoffs/pegs with your kit. I am sure Luca will be happy to help you out with this situation.

Sorry to hear you have some frustrations and I'm sure we all have some frustrations with products that we purchased and it's good that you brought out the problem to the open.

I just want you to know that I don't get paid by Lynx nor do I get any free stuff from Lynx except for a Lynx team pilot T-shirt that I haven't received yet neither (LOL), but I think Lynx put out a lot of good products and they stand behind their products. Believe me, if I think a product s*ucks, I'll let them know.

Tonight is the first time I've had the chance to check things out and see what the situation really is. The above is what I found. I'm not the only one with issues here buddy.

I agree lynx generally does a good job and yes, stuff does happen. I'm just reporting on the issue that are effecting me and likely others. I think/hope the screws I have on the way will resolve my issue and the above info will help others to resolve theirs.

[DWill]

Originally Posted by Centurian

Tonight is the first time I've had the chance to check things out and see what the situation really is. The above is what I found. I'm not the only one with issues here buddy.

I agree lynx generally does a good job and yes, stuff does happen. I'm just reporting on the issue that are effecting me and likely others. I think/hope the screws I have on the way will resolve my issue and the above info will help others to resolve theirs.

I have to agree. I think Lynx makes some very nice products. But I had the e a t same problem; solved it a different way but the same problem nom the less.

The screws really should be longer.

[helibus]

Originally Posted by Centurian

...What I am finding is the screws will slide into the aluminum stand offs .7-1.5mm before the screw engages the threads in the stand off.

Good point on that. The unthreaded recess is actually very standard on standoffs - in typical applications, it makes alignment of the mating screws much easier. Over the years, I've ran across a few standoffs without the recess in electronic applications and they can be a pain.

When you get them, let us know how the M1.7 screws you ordered from osorail fit in the M1.6 threaded standoffs.

[helibus]

Originally Posted by nartac

How to install Lynx frame stiffener to 300x - YouTube

Comments...

1) Measuring the 8mm of thread poking through the frame is of marginal point. What is being forgotten here is that there's a lot of plastic from the two frame parts that the screw passes through before it engages with the threaded pin or standoff. In the stock config, self tapping screws passed through the wall of one frame half and engaged with the frame wall of the other half. The M1.6 screw is passing through and engaging with those same plastic walls.

2) As I pointed out earlier, a lot of the threading one notices is actually the M1.6 bolt threading through the plastic, not into the pin/standoff.

3) If threadlocker is going to be used on the long screws, it should be dabbed inside the threaded pin/standoff before inserting the pin into the frame. If threadlocker is applied to the screws, it will be wiped clean when the screw engages in the plastic, and you're doing a no-no by getting threadlocker on the plastic of the frame.

Anyone still doubting how little of the 12mm screw threads into the pin/standoff should do what I did and poke a piece of wire, pin, or straightened paper clip into the open end of the standoff after the long screw is installed. Use that to measure the remaining depth of the standoff. That was the eye-opener for me.

EDIT: The 8mm measurement of remaining thread factors the plastic wall of one part of the frame. It isn't factoring the plastic wall in the other frame half.

EDIT#2: To clarify, I came into this thread originally disagreeing with Centurian. After close evaluation, however, I now agree. The screws should be longer than 12mm.

[helibus]

For anyone interested, here is hard data from measurements taken on a new frame just received for crash repairs. Left vs right side references are as if viewed from the tail. The "right" side ends up with the brace plate applied to it. My caliper's depth measurement pin doesn't fit through the frame holes, so multiple measurements were made indirectly with a stiff piece of wire and averaged.

On the left side of the frame, the original pan head sheet metal screws pass through holes with a 3mm frame wall. This was measured to the inside of the engagement recess in the frame, since a nub on the other frame side will mate with the recess. The M1.6 machine screws provided in the brace kit also pass through these holes without any binding or engagement.

On the right side of the frame, there is about 7mm of plastic depth in the holes for the original pan head sheet metal screws to engage with. The inner hole diameter is smaller on this side so the pan head screws would cut into it. Here, the M1.6 machine screws from the brace kit will also engage with and thread into the plastic.

So, the M1.6x12 long screws provided in the brace kit pass through about 3+7 or 10mm of plastic before the screws can begin to engage with the aluminum post. The screws will cut threads into 7mm of this.

In my reinstall of the brace on the new frame, I am going with longer screws. I am also going to enlarge the inner holes on the left frame side just enough so that the M1.6 machine screws pass through the holes without threading into the plastic. Otherwise, tightening the aluminum post to the frame first requires shearing the threads cut into the plastic by the screw. I'd rather not risk snapping the screw or damaging the threads in the aluminum post doing this.

[Centurian]

Originally Posted by helibus

For anyone interested, here is hard data....

I stand behind my hard data. The screws are 1.5mm as measured. Engagement is ~1.5mm and the stand offs don't engage screws for .5-1.5 mm depending on the stand off.

[helibus]

Originally Posted by Centurian

I stand behind my hard data. The screws are 1.5mm as measured. Engagement is ~1.5mm and the stand offs don't engage screws for .5-1.5 mm depending on the stand off.

I'm sure the small difference between your 1.5mm engagement and what would be 2mm in my data is likely error sum on the measurement approach for my unassembled parts. I haven't disassembled the broken frame so I haven't measured the unthreaded part of the standoffs, but it's likely there as it is typical on machined standoffs.

As stated earlier, I've done a 180 on this issue after giving it a serious look. My longer screws are now on order. And I bet there are a lot of brace installations out there where the long M1.6 screws are only threaded into the plastic of the frame, not into the standoff. If one doesn't torque the screws during installation enough to shear the plastic threading, you'd never know.

I try to always make the best out of what I have. Thank you for convincing me to take a look at the issue for myself.

[Dylwad]

Sounds like maybe the brace should come with longer screws and a drill bit to clearance the plastic holes for the screws.

[Centurian]

Originally Posted by Dylwad

Sounds like maybe the brace should come with longer screws and a drill bit to clearance the plastic holes for the screws.

Or a deburring tool for mystery burrs

My crusade for longer screws continues. I ordered the 1.7's you suggested before removing the brace. The needed 1.5x14+mm screws are not too difficult to source, we'll see. I have yet to find any standard for 1.7mm threads, will be interesting to see what shows up.

[helibus]

The hardware in the Lynx kit is M1.6. I know this since I had used my own hardware on the original installation (been burnt by too many manufacturers shipping with low quality hardware, so now I typically obtain my own to use instead). M1.6 machine screws do measure less than 1.6mm thread diameter - mine measure at 1.56mm.

M1.7 is rare, but it is out there. It has the same 0.35mm thread pitch as common M1.6. I could find no references listing specs for 1.5mm/M1.5 machine screws to compare to.

Not wanting to risk whether the osrail M1.7 screw would work, I went with rcscrewz for the M1.6x16. McMaster does offer M1.6 in extended lengths, but they're slotted cheese head. Came up empty in my other sources for hardware.

[Centurian]

the screws shipped with my brace measure ~1.46mm they are 1.5.

[helibus]

Originally Posted by Centurian

the screws shipped with my brace measure ~1.46mm they are 1.5.

I'd be curious to know where you found 1.5mm machine screws for sale, since I came up empty in looking for any. Sounds to me like you may have a second problem on your hands - that the hardware you received was undersized for the M1.6 Lynx publishes as being used.

[ininverno]

From our check we diacovery some change on the frame compare the first edition we use per design.
Whathever we already order longer screw m1.6 x 14 and we will use those screw asap will arrive. Hope next week available.
If someone you need those longed screw can contact us by ticket and we can arrange to send free parts in a next order.

About screw diamater you need consider the std diameter tollerance.
A screw m1.6 will never 1.6 in diameter. M1.6 . Min diameter 1.50 Max diameter 1.55. You can find those info online on technical data book.

Sent from my GT-I9500 using Tapatalk

[Centurian]

Received the 1.7mm screws and they are indeed too big = (

Of interest, the actual measured dias:
included short screws 1.54mm
Included long screws 1.46mm I would say these are actually 1.5mm screws
the 1.7mm screws 1.64mm

The 1.7's will go into the stand offs a few turns before they snug up. Looks to me that the stand off threads are a bit bell shaped from the tapping as they appear to be fully threaded to the end and as stated the 1.64mm dia screws will go in a few turns.... come on lynx, we need ya!!

[Uriah]

I just submitted a support ticket to Lynx requesting longer screws. The M1.6x12 hex screws provided are too short for my 300X frame as well. Only 4 out of the 8 screws tapped into the aluminum pins. I just spent over an hour trying to get the other 4 hex screws to tap into the pins, but no luck. I'm positive the aluminum pins are in all the way - channel locks (LOL) don't lie.

[DIPswitch]

I have only 2 of the 8 screws reaching the pins thru the frame. After reading , I didn't give tons of effort because it seems pointless.
Did lynx respond to your ticket ?

[mallstott]

I guess I'm just lucky. I just finished replacing my frame and didn't have any problems reusing the lynx frame brace. I did press hard to get the pieces fully seated but I didn't use a hammer or anything. Odd...

-Mike-

[Uriah]

Originally Posted by DIPswitch

I have only 2 of the 8 screws reaching the pins thru the frame. After reading , I didn't give tons of effort because it seems pointless.
Did lynx respond to your ticket ?

Yes they responded, but they made me place another order before they would send me the correct screws. I understand it's an international shipment, but it's not my fault that Lynx failed to keep up with the 300X manufacturing process, so I'm of the opinion they should pay for shipping costs even though it's just some dumb screws. They're basically selling a product that doesn't work, and it's their job to keep their products compatible with the 300X, not the other way around. So I'm a bit disappointed with them for not fully owning up to their end of the bargain, which is to sell aftermarket parts that are supposed to be compatible with my 300X. I fulfilled my part of the bargain - I bought their product.



It's virtually impossible to find M1.6x14 screws anywhere.

[DWill]

I have to agree, I'm in no way a Lynx basher.

However, I was disapointed when I spent my money on the frame stiffener only to spend a couple hours trying to get screws that are too short to fit the frame.

Then another hour finding a work around.

IMO, if you're making and selling aftermarket parts you should spend the time to keep up with changes in the products you're building parts for and not have your customers doing it for you. Worse yet is to tell them they are doing something wrong when they tell you of a problem.

Makes me wonder what other Lynx products are out of date.

[helidude71]

Originally Posted by Uriah

Yes they responded, but they made me place another order before they would send me the correct screws. I understand it's an international shipment, but it's not my fault that Lynx failed to keep up with the 300X manufacturing process, so I'm of the opinion they should pay for shipping costs even though it's just some dumb screws. They're basically selling a product that doesn't work, and it's their job to keep their products compatible with the 300X, not the other way around. So I'm a bit disappointed with them for not fully owning up to their end of the bargain, which is to sell aftermarket parts that are supposed to be compatible with my 300X. I fulfilled my part of the bargain - I bought their product.



It's virtually impossible to find M1.6x14 screws anywhere.

Thx for sharing, I'm not getting one.
Let the frame flex a bit, who cares.