Gut-wrenching UDI to Vbar failure

[prototype3a]

Thoughtless?

No one knows what the cause of the problems were. It has been ASSUMED that the packet spacing was the problem. Initially, Esprit blamed the Vbar and Spirit units for not being able to handle the random packet spacing claiming that their processors were not fast enough for the Jeti data streams. When I called Esprit for help with a Jeti/Vbar issue over a year ago, I was told that no one there flys Vbar. In fact, I think it was you, James, who told me this.

The impression I get from all the info I've seen on the issue is that Mikado gave Jeti a Mini Vbar to test with and Jeti(CZ) put it in a drawer somewhere and forgot about it until recently. THIS is my speculation. The above paragraph is FACT.

You can not say conclusively that the problem with the REX receivers has only affected two pilots because there is absolutely no way for you to know this.

Next time, please think about what you are going to say before you post something that is obviously emotional.

[TeroS]

Originally Posted by helijames

Your "proven" defect only affected 2 pilots who were able to provide adequate evidence. The "defect" only affected third party devices and not direct to servo, or serial link to Jeti devices. I understand that there was a potential for problems for those flying Spirit and Vbar, but a lot of us who adopted REX early never had a problem. Jeti made changes to accommodate those pilots flying VBar and Spirit and TeroS shows clearly that the condition that Cbdane recorded has been changed.
There isn't another radio company on the planet that hasn't had to make revisions to either hardware or software for their product so why is it any different now that it's Jeti. I get slightly offended when people make thoughtless statements about the product that I have supported professionally and flown without failure for the last three years.
End Rant
James/Esprit Model

Regarding this issue, here's more information summarized from my email-exchange with Jetimodel this week:

• Mikado's document (from 2010) over their UDI-protocol has all the necessary information of data-structure and so on. But nothing over the timing.
  
• This was not an issue in R-receivers due their processor because receivers needed some time to prepare the UDI-packet before sending it to output. Servo pulses and UDI cannot go out on the same time, therefore there were gaps between UDI-packets by default and timing-issue to 3rd party devices never actuated.
  
• When REX was initially done because of their more powerful processors Jeti decided to send the UDI-packet out as soon as it arrived from transmitter to receiver. This is the issue, this resulted in some FBL-units getting UDI-packets too fast. For example VStabi have now stated that there needs to be 2ms gap between UDI-packets. This information is not in their documentation. (Basically, Jeti has "too powerful"l receivers!)
  
• Due this issue Jetimodel added a minimum 2ms gap between UDI-packet to REX-receivers firmware 1.01. This has also been proven to work as promised, it is now impossible to get smaller gaps. (In theory one could get 200Hz update from receiver to gyro (within spec's!) if only transmitter would support it )

The issue is in fact that 3rd party devices could not keep up with the speed of REX-receivers and Jetimodel had to slow REX-down with UDI. This is conclusive, and this is a fact.

Rest is pure speculation and debatable. Who's to blame? Well, in my eyes no-one.

The fact is that Jetimodel cannot test every 3rd-party device out there, it is simply impossible.

Last, honestly, how many other radio-manufacturer's do you know who responds to issues with this much engagement and with this kind of speed?

Am i biased towards Jeti? Heck yes I am. I love the radio, support from manufacturer, their engagement in business and their open way of communication.

PS: I just helped a fellow helidude to configure JLog to his Futaba 14SG. After today I'm even more in love with my DS-16...

[TeroS]

Originally Posted by prototype3a

Thoughtless?

No one knows what the cause of the problems were. It has been ASSUMED that the packet spacing was the problem.

...

Sorry, but wrong. It has been PROVEN by Jetimodel that packet spacing was the issue. VBar makes invalid servo-outputs on too short gaps and Spirit may hang when it cannot manage more data.

What comes to your comment on VBar in a drawer, well, I do not know. I haven't been to Jetimodel's drawers, have you?

In my opinion all this is now irrelevant, facts are proven, problems are fixed, let's go out and have fun on the flying field

[prototype3a]

What stopped Jeti engineers from contacting Mikado and asking 'Hey, we were looking at this document you sent and there is no mention of any packet spacing spec. Is this an issue?"

I work in a technical field and I contact people all the time for clarification on their documents. Sometimes, people make mistakes or forget things.

[Mattinfla]

Originally Posted by prototype3a

What stopped Jeti engineers from contacting Mikado and asking 'Hey, we were looking at this document you sent and there is no mention of any packet spacing spec. Is this an issue?"

I work in a technical field and I contact people all the time for clarification on their documents. Sometimes, people make mistakes or forget things.

Look, you asked and answered your question in the same post

[Snowflake6515]

I have been on both sides of similar issues over my career. If the spec isn't complete (hindsight), then I, personally, would find it hard to criticize the Jeti folks for not foreseeing a potential problem.

I'm with Teros in that Jeti responded quickly once the problem was identified. I also agree about how difficult it is to test every device combination...

Michael

Originally Posted by prototype3a

What stopped Jeti engineers from contacting Mikado and asking 'Hey, we were looking at this document you sent and there is no mention of any packet spacing spec. Is this an issue?"

I work in a technical field and I contact people all the time for clarification on their documents. Sometimes, people make mistakes or forget things.

[rchelipastor]

I'm normally pretty quiet about these things but i have to say that James is right. Jeti is top notch, and let me add that Spirit and Vbar are also amazing products. I only use spirit and a few ikons but I've flown vbar and I'm also impressed. With that said, why in the world would Jeti have any desire to "shelf something" that is so important to their customers? It doesn't benefit anybody, and it's simply not good business. Both Jeti and esprit model have proven, Beyond any shadow of doubt, that they care about their customers and or more than willing too make a world class product even better. One of the things that make these radios the best is the fact the the manufacturer has designed the platform to be conducive to Instant updates that reflect and satisfy both the demands and concerns of their customers. Jeti and esprit (as the liaison) have proven that time and time again. I am DYING inside to here about the velos. It stinks, but thank God that we can prevent things like this from happening again. We are ALL learning in this hobby, and personally thank you for posting about this because it makes me better as a builder and pilot...

[Coco66]

Originally Posted by rchelipastor

I'm normally pretty quiet about these things but i have to say that James is right. Jeti is top notch, and let me add that Spirit and Vbar are also amazing products. I only use spirit and a few ikons but I've flown vbar and I'm also impressed. With that said, why in the world would Jeti have any desire to "shelf something" that is so important to their customers? It doesn't benefit anybody, and it's simply not good business. Both Jeti and esprit model have proven, Beyond any shadow of doubt, that they care about their customers and or more than willing too make a world class product even better. One of the things that make these radios the best is the fact the the manufacturer has designed the platform to be conducive to Instant updates that reflect and satisfy both the demands and concerns of their customers. Jeti and esprit (as the liaison) have proven that time and time again. I am DYING inside to here about the velos. It stinks, but thank God that we can prevent things like this from happening again. We are ALL learning in this hobby, and personally thank you for posting about this because it makes me better as a builder and pilot...

You got me here... what do you mean with that??

[Puttputt maru]

Originally Posted by Coco66

You got me here... what do you mean with that??

Have you read the first post of this thread

[Coco66]

Originally Posted by Puttputt maru

Have you read the first post of this thread

Now I see. You meant TO HEAR (you wrote TO HERE).

(Moreover, the first post is more than a month old, I forgot about it long ago )))))))))))))))))))

[Puttputt maru]

Originally Posted by Coco66

Now I see. You meant TO HEAR (you wrote TO HERE).

(Moreover, the first post is more than a month old, I forgot about it long ago )))))))))))))))))))

Well have a look at what was crashed you will not forget it, it was a beauty:
https://www.helifreak.com/showpost.p...32&postcount=6

[Coco66]

Originally Posted by Puttputt maru

Well have a look at what was crashed you will not forget it, it was a beauty:
https://www.helifreak.com/showpost.p...32&postcount=6

Mamma mia! (Kinda equivalent of "OMG" in Italian).
It was for sure! That's sad.

[rchelipastor]

sorry about the stupid spelling error, I hate autocorrect....

[Coco66]

Originally Posted by rchelipastor

sorry about the stupid spelling error, I hate autocorrect....

No need to be sorry... just turn autocorrect off )))