The Official Rotormast "V22 Osprey" Build Thread

[kouzlo5]

Thanks for the responses Wazzer and billyd. Time for full disclosure, I suppose.

I work at a research facility that does quite a bit of work on helicopters and tiltrotors, but we are typically limited to wind tunnel model testing or full-scale flight testing (verrrry expensive). To be honest, the $2-3K cost of this model is not prohibitive by any means.

We have a lot of folks here who are extremely impressed and excited by this model and are coming up with all sorts of experiments to perform as we speak. To that note, we also have two or three experienced RC pilots/real pilots who will eventually be manning the controls. I have absolutely no doubt in my mind that if I took the controls, the flight would be over before it began.

As one of the more junior engineers, I get the task of everything right up until I hand over the controls for the first test flight.

I know that for many of you who have to try to find time outside of work to put these together, you probably want to strange a complete amateur who can not only work on it during the normal work day, but actually gets paid for it (don't worry, it's not very much ).

[kouzlo5]

More component stuff:

I was actually looking at the Hercules 5A/6V BEC. Guess I copied over the wrong column from my Excel spreadsheet. The 6 servos was also a typo. So far it doesn't look like I'm building a very good case for myself.

Although no formal RC experience, I am a mechanical engineer by schooling, and have spent a lot of my high school years working in a wood/machine shop so I'm quite handy with tools and intricate detailing. It's deciphering a lot of the component specifications and understanding how everything in the model works together that I am slowly figuring out.

Sounds like I want to stick with the Hitec 5085s, despite the fit problem. Thanks for describing the approach for achieving your fit, billyd.

Any other thoughts on ESCs, gyros, or transmitters/receivers?

[flymustangs]

The attached pictures to show how I mounted my 5085's. Tom said this was the way the prototype was done, but went to the current design so the servos could be replaced without splitting the frames. It would take a little effort, but I think they could be replaced using this method.

The kit is done very well and it's been a fun build, but I would certainly not recommed it for a first time builder. It would probably be a good idea to have several builds under your belt before attempting this one. Other mechanical experience will help, but it will be a steep learning curve.

It's also not just mechanical. I haven't got to the controller setup part yet, but it looks pretty intense. I think I'll be OK with it because I've done many vbar and a couple of skookum setups.

Take your time and if something doesn't look right, it probably isn't. There are still a few errors in the current plans so be careful with that. There are a few people building them now so you should be able to get answers to any questions you have.

[kouzlo5]

I appreciate your frankness that this is not a beginner model, and please do not think I am taking it lightly. This is something that we are going to do and I certainly do not expect it to be an easy process. It will be slow, and I am sure mistakes will be made (hopefully not too $$$). But there are a handful of guys here who are very experienced with RC helis and airplanes that I have as resources. That being said, you folks have not only lots of experience, but experience with this particular model, so your advice is invaluable.

Out of curiosity, about how long did your guys' builds take? Both the mechanical assembly, and electronic/software work. I'm trying to get a baseline of time spent... so I can multiply it by 10 for our model.

[Varc]

This is sweet! Do the wings/rotors tilt forward for forward flight like the real one does?

When will somebody do the Harrier Jump Jet?

[v22chap]

kouzlo5
Sent you a PM with some information on the build .

Marcwolf
Yes they do tilt forward and it flies very fast in airplane mode !!!! The mechanics of this little sweet heart are just awsome and the controller that does all the work is governor controlled to take a lot of the pilot work load off you by keeping the motor RPM and collective just where it should be to make the conversion and stay flying without stalling out the motors .

[billyd]

Originally Posted by kouzlo5

More component stuff:

I was actually looking at the Hercules 5A/6V BEC. Guess I copied over the wrong column from my Excel spreadsheet. The 6 servos was also a typo. So far it doesn't look like I'm building a very good case for myself.

Although no formal RC experience, I am a mechanical engineer by schooling, and have spent a lot of my high school years working in a wood/machine shop so I'm quite handy with tools and intricate detailing. It's deciphering a lot of the component specifications and understanding how everything in the model works together that I am slowly figuring out.

Sounds like I want to stick with the Hitec 5085s, despite the fit problem. Thanks for describing the approach for achieving your fit, billyd.

Any other thoughts on ESCs, gyros, or transmitters/receivers?

Well you could write several books on that and 100 people would give you 100 different opinions. But for you and this model I would say for a Tx go with the JR x9503. It has side sliders for the nacelles which I think is important. Another good radio would be the DX8 by Spektrum. But the DX8 has the nob on top for the nacelles which means taking your hand off the stick for a second to adjust it. Not a big deal since the V22 has 3 gyros (stable), It's cheaper than the JR too.

When you buy a Tx be sure to get one that comes with a Rx in the package and you'll save a little money. Just be sure it's at least 7 channels for the V22. You want to get mode 2. That means throttle/rudder on the left stick and aileron/elevator on the right which is standard in the US, The radio will need at least 7 proportional (variable as opposed to essentially an on off switch) channels. A few radios claim x channels, but not all are proportional, so be careful about that.

For me, the best helicopter ESC's are Kontronik hands down. But they are pricey. Tom did all of the prototyping with the CC Ice 50 lites (I think) and you see how good it flies, so they are fine,

Gyros well the Futaba 401's are dinosaurs but they work well (for non 3d flight), (3d meaning sometimes inverted and along with relatively violent moves of the control sticks) and are very easy to set up. Most of the newer hi tech gyros have gobs of settings accessible via computer (Quark, Gy520, etc.). These are designed for hard 3d and nobody is going to fly the V22 like that (I don't think lol). For this model I think those kind are overkill and for a beginner to RC would be a big headache to figure out. So get the 401s.

Anyway these are just suggestions you could go with none of these and do just fine. There's a million options.

edit Ps I can't believe I forgot the Futaba 10CHP which is another fantastic radio. But that one is an example of what I was saying earlier, 10 channels, but only 8 proportional. Fine for the V22 though.

[flymustangs]

I would suggest the 8FG over the 10CHP if you're going with Futaba. It's a newer radio and is also 8 proportional plus 2 digital channels. It will be 12 + 2 when the upcoming firmware update is released. It also has an SD card to allow the field update.

I use the 8FG for most things, but I also have a JR 9503. I like them both. The 8FG has more programming capabilities, but that also makes it more complicated to program. The 8FG can't fly my BNF models, though.

I didn't answer the question about how long the build takes because I'm not done yet! I'm just at the point of installing the control links.

[Cletus]

Very tempting project indeed.

[v22chap]

Come on Cletus .... you know you really have to have one

It is an engineering piece of art . which knowing you as I do ,,, know you would enjoy the build ,,if for no other reason than that !!!
Not to mention the flying challenge that it presents

Arm twisting over with now

[billyd]

Actually once the nacelles are built the rest of the model is very quick. Mostly software setup. Mine is essentially finished and I work very slowly and not everyday, and also not for more than a few hours at a time. I would say a quick builder could do it in a couple of days.

Regarding Tx choice and the Futaba vs JR that's exactly why I rec'd the JR. Programming the Futaba's are pretty cryptic and the guy said he was new to RC. I figured he'd have enough on his hands with the V22!

[v22chap]

I worked on mine for about 1 week to build (and I am not new to building a V-22 ) ... and probably 8 hrs per day ( and some of that was at work and all weekend .... then setup took another probably week ,,checking and rechecking / tweaking first hovers and I rushed it to much and had some mishaps because of it ... but I was rushing trying to get some forward flight before the snow and wind set in here in Michiana (lake effect and all )

Of course some of that time was doing some proof reading and checking of parts fit for Tom ... but still it was about as fast as I could imagine it being built and done right .

I would suggest to anyone to take their time and take it at an easy pace ,,, it will save you time and headaches in the long run . There are a lot of long hard areas that need thought out a little before you start and have to tear it back apart ,, and tweaking and routing to secure things that needs to be thought out a little before finalizing it all .

[billyd]

Originally Posted by v22chap

I worked on mine for about 1 week to build (and I am not new to building a V-22 ) ... and probably 8 hrs per day ( and some of that was at work and all weekend .... then setup took another probably week ,,checking and rechecking / tweaking first hovers and I rushed it to much and had some mishaps because of it ... but I was rushing trying to get some forward flight before the snow and wind set in here in Michiana (lake effect and all )

Of course some of that time was doing some proof reading and checking of parts fit for Tom ... but still it was about as fast as I could imagine it being built and done right .

I would suggest to anyone to take their time and take it at an easy pace ,,, it will save you time and headaches in the long run . There are a lot of long hard areas that need thought out a little before you start and have to tear it back apart ,, and tweaking and routing to secure things that needs to be thought out a little before finalizing it all .

Well yes I suppose my 2 days was a little optimistic. But in my defense I've kind of lost track of how much time I've spent on it because I work a little at a time. The nacelles were slow (installing the servos took awhile for me to figure out) and routing the wiring was time consuming, but putting the rest together was really quick. The software was pretty easy to set up but then again I haven't flown it yet so there may be alot of tweeking ahead. Setting the links up precisely per the manual led to everything being pretty well squared up without many changes. I'm living off the groundwork of the V22 crew.

Anyway I got the kit a couple of weeks ago and I probably put on average about 2 hours a day. But I consider myself very slow. Some of these guys on here talk about build times of ARF's and they say stuff like a couple of evenings and for me on the same model it was 2-3 weeks of hard labor lol. I don't know besides the servo install it went together for me pretty easily. Of course now that I said that the RC gods are going to make me pay.

[Cletus]

Originally Posted by v22chap

Come on Cletus .... you know you really have to have one

It is an engineering piece of art . which knowing you as I do ,,, know you would enjoy the build ,,if for no other reason than that !!!
Not to mention the flying challenge that it presents

Arm twisting over with now

I hear you Larry! .....wife has some remodeling plans for the house this year. Maybe after that's done

[v22chap]

billyd
Well with what I said,, it is still a pretty easy build and controller set up ... Now
I guess helping work out some of the first bugs did take a little of that time ....

We can compromise and say it took 1 week + to build and setup .... but I don't know how long it will take to complete the setup ... as you need to fly it into conversion at 10 degree incriments and set the gyro gains on all axis so as not to get hunting at that angle of conversion . This part is going to take a couple weeks .... depending on how many chances you get to fly during the week .


Cletus
Ya ,,, you have to keep the other half happy to ...

[v22chap]

Lubebosch
Little more on the realflight V -22 ... I got mine up and running again ... and yes the huey does handle a lot like the V ..but there is still nothing there to present the veiw that you see of the V -22 flying and that is half the fight of flying the V !!!! As you lift off into a hover you almost stop moving the controls it in awe ... and even more so as you start to do conversions ...you tend to stop moving the controls and want to just watch

So I have been playing with modifying the flight charateristics of the realflight V ,,trying to make it close to what it handles like ... it is still a little sensitive on the elevator axis and not quick in the hover / landing area like the real one will be ,,but in the air it handles about the same .
So I am going to post a zipped G3X file for you to import to realflight and see if it feels better

[flymustangs]

Hey Larry, what version of RF for that file?

[Cletus]

So, assuming I already have a TX (12X) and a supply of batteries, what's the all-up cost on one of these birds?
....as he looks at sneaking it into the house remodeling budget

I will try to play with it in the RF sim tonight.

[v22chap]

That file is from a 3.5 version... but should do for anything from 3.0 up ????!!!! don't know that for sure though .
You do need to have the plane upgrade for their V-22 loaded first .

Cletus .
I don't keep track of costs !!!! it would scare me to much ... but I think some where around 2000.00 to 2500.00 by the time you get 2 - esc. 3- gyro's . 4- servos and a 10 Amp Bec. ,,, which hopefully soon we won't need the Bec . Tom is working on getting the controller up to handle the ESC's built in Bec .
It also depends on if you get the profile kit or the scale fuselage kit (that is a difference of 300.00 or so ) Both profile and full scale will do the full conversion flight and it is cheaper and easier to do it without the scale fuse on .... money fear factor and all and this coming from a guy who has had a turbine helicopter in the air since they first came out
Heck ... you could label it as larger air conditioning upgrade on the house ,, as it does stir the air really good while setting things up on tracking and such

[hoot]

Originally Posted by Cletus

So, assuming I already have a TX (12X) and a supply of batteries, what's the all-up cost on one of these birds?
....as he looks at sneaking it into the house remodeling budget

I will try to play with it in the RF sim tonight.

I have about $2600 in mine including the batteries. I think I posted the list earlier.