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Old 02-17-2015, 03:49 PM   #1
JPizzleMcDizzle
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Default Just learning, questions about realism!

Ok guys I'm very new to the rc heli world, and I got Phoenix for my laptop to do aome hover training and get the hang of the controls without crashing my real heli (trex 450 clone). I can hover just fine with the real heli, and in Phoenix.
My question is about the "realism" of Phoenix. I've read mixed reviews on the physics, and that's not what I want to discuss. I've been playing with the settings of the model, basically trying to make it harder and harder to fly.
My thinking is that if I make the Phoenix model really over sensitive and hard to fly, and I can master it, that'll make the real deal be easier.
I've turned the hover stability down to 0, and the ground effect up to 100%. My thinking is that in real life there will be at least a little bit of hover stability, and the ground effect won't be off the wall aggressive, so if I can practice with an over sensitive model, the real deal will be easier to switch to. I also have the wind set to a pretty problematic setting, and I have disabled the preset throttle curves, as well as slowing down my tail servo, and I've experimented with flying in both rate and hh mode.
So does anyone have any thoughts on this approach? I Figure there's got to be settings that get as close to real as possible, but if I make it harder than real life, isn't that good?
Or maybe I'm a total noob and have no clue what's going on haha
Any help/advice would be awesome!
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Old 02-17-2015, 06:01 PM   #2
Nelsonisms
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In my mind the value of a sim for a beginner is in training your reactions in the various orientations to make the correct moves regardless of the actual conditions or responsiveness of the heli. Once you've mastered upright forward flight then start mixing in upright backwards, inverted forward, inverted backwards etc. After all of those are second nature then you can start worrying about making it ultra responsive and all that. Your reactions will be trained and you'll find that changes to the responsiveness or the conditions are easy to assimilate. In short, focus on learning to fly in all orientations and not so much on all that other stuff, at least not in the beginning. Once you can do that you'll find that everything else, like compensating for conditions and advanced aerobatics, come easily because you're comfortable controlling the heli no matter how it is situated in the air.

For instance, think of something like a botched piro-flip where you come out going straight toward the ground inverted tail first. Someone who isn't comfortable in all orientations would probably freak out and waste precious time trying to get it back to upright tail in instead of just flying out of it inverted tail first. The more time you spend training your reactions for all orientations the easier time you'll have when you really want to start pushing the limits.
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Old 02-17-2015, 07:19 PM   #3
GregCA
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+100

I fly a 450 IRL. I like to fly the 450- to 500-size helis in Phoenix. Any smaller and they are really twitchy; any larger and they feel much "weightier" and more "stable" than my real-life machine. As far as learning the fundamentals is concerned, the exact model you choose is not that important.

I think the key to progress is to fly daily and to fly with purpose. Sure you can goof around some in the sim, but having a program to follow really helps. I've found Archmage's From tail-in to all 8s and funnels in 6 months to be really helpful. If you learn the basics as outlined in Archmage's program, you will be well on your way to really being able to control your helicopter.
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Old 02-17-2015, 08:19 PM   #4
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I think making the sim harder as you describe is fine once you have the skills and you want to improve them. One of the key advantages of a sim is you can tone things down until you have learn't how to control the heli. Making it harder for your brain to react initially is not necessarily going to make you learn faster. Possibly the opposite.
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Old 02-18-2015, 04:54 AM   #5
Toocool4
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Nelsonisms has it nailed.

Setting the sim way out of whack will not help, making the sim a little bit more difficult will help.

Setting the wind to hurricane level will not help, as you will not be able to fly in it in real life while you are learning .
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Old 02-19-2015, 01:32 PM   #6
JPizzleMcDizzle
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Alright sweet thanks guys. Starting to make sense to me now
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Old 02-19-2015, 02:11 PM   #7
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Just to throw-in my experience, after flying an MCPX and sim models after changing the "generic" setting to the most advanced setting, I got a T-rex 450 Pro DFC with an AR7200bx (I used default settings for the AR7200 except I elected to use my transmitter for DR/Expo instead of the pre-set options). Being scared to death of the 450 heli, I set my servo travel to like 70% and my expo to maybe 30. The problem was, it was too tame, and I was afraid to move the sticks much, expecting it to dart-off like my MCPX or at least move like my sim models. While collective felt very sensitive, the heli steered like a brick. I crashed on maybe my 4th or 5th flight during little more than a hover, simply because I was too scared to make the stick movements I needed to really operate the heli. I then started increasing travel and reducing expo on the real heli, and started increasing Hoverability and other parameters to make the Phoenix model fly more like my 450. Once I got the two pretty close, I became much better at flying the 450.

My point is, there is soooo much difference between flying a small, plastic micro or a computer model, and a "real" heli that could possibly kill you or somebody else. You are probably not the chicken sh@t that I am, who is? However, don't underestimate the fear and adrenaline you will deal with flying your "real" heli vs. a sim or micro, especially once you get past hovering. My advice is to make the sim as much like your "real" heli as possible so when you fly IRL, you aren't dealing with the realization that the two feel so much different.
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