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Old 10-07-2009, 10:21 PM   #1
Finless
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Default Airtronics SD-10G Radio Videos!

OK... let me start out by saying I have never really used a Airtronics radio before. Not because I thought the radio was bad or anything but because I was always a Futaba man and when 2.4 came out migrated to JR.

So, Terry Moore contacted me about possibly doing videos for the new AT SD-10G. Now I actually held this new radio in my hand at my clubs OCMA funfly in June this year. Airtronics showed up with a booth so it was cool to see this new radio even before it was out. I liked how it felt and it looked like a good radio! But again... I was worried it was going to be real different so didn't give it much thought. Terry contacted me about it and I said sure. Let me have a looks see.

Well folks I have to say I was PLEASANTLY surprised! The manual was one of the best out there for a radio and I spent the first night reading it while the radio was charging. MAN.. I wanted to turn it on and start playing after reading about some of the features this radio has but had to wait for it to charge. Some of the features on this radio are revolutionary honestly! Like the power up menu only system. Like the 3 button favorite model menu buttons. LIKE that you can program anything to do anything like my 14MZ or my 9Z radios could! The more I read... the more I was getting excited It was a new toy and sounding like a fun one

Anyway, I am not telling you to rush right out and buy this radio because I like it Which I do.... Watch the videos and see what the radio can do. YOU judge... I think Airtronics hit the mark with this radio for sure. I hope my videos show this point and you consider this as a radio choice. I for sure would recommend it to anyone looking for a new radio and that is a no BS truth! For the price it's top notch if not better than some out there costing a lot more. It has more power than my X9303 and is even better with the SWASH menu details and capabilities than my 10C! NO... I am not kidding! I cant wait to get this sucker on a heli and use it....

For those wondering about speed and latency.... Well we can only wait for JKOS or someone to report that info but if this thing is as fast as the Stylus... It's going to be one of the fastest radios out there. My simple tests on the bench with servos seem to show positive on speed. Can't wait to actually fly it but that will come after I get these vids done.

Also, as I go through these videos feel free to ask me to cover more about something if I didn't cover it in enough detail. I do my best to start but as always someone wants to know how to do something I didn't think of. If so just ask and I will do my best to cover it.

OK so I am babbling and maybe it's the new toy syndrome but........ on with the videos:

Video Link ->What's in the box and radio overview (68 Megs)

Video Link ->Adjusting the Stick Tension (24 Megs)

Video Link ->Binding a RX and Understanding RX codes (48 Megs)

Video Link ->Main Screen, Top Level Menu Structure & Menu Navigation (82 Megs)



Video Link ->System Menu Overview Part 1 - Sys Menus 01 through 10 (75 Megs)

Video Link ->System Menu Overview Part 2 - Sys Menus 11 through 15 (75 Megs)

Video Link ->System Menu Overview Part 3 - Menus 16 through 25 (57 Megs)

OK because someone asked about Ergonomics, I shot this video AD-HOC.... Here you go and my opinion about ergonomics!
Video Link ->Radio Ergonomics and my opinion! (60 Megs)

OK onto more details I didn't cover in the system menu! Stick calibration... DAMN guys I think I babbled too much here as this video is long but I wanted to cover WHY and what not. Feedback if I did babble too much would be nice
Video Link ->System Menu - Stick Calibration (110 Megs)

OK another special video in the System menus that shows you how to setup an "auto" start stick timer! Enjoy!
Video Link ->System Menu - Setting up an "auto" start stick timer (53 Megs)

Sorry for the LONG dealy in getting these done. Life happens and the only free time I had was spent on flying
Anyway onto the Surface Menus!

Video Link ->Surface Menus Part 1 (42 Megs)

Video Link ->Surface Menus Part 2 (80 Megs)

OK....onto the F-Mode menus! This is where it gets a little hard and I will do my BEST to explain the many ways to use this menu system and also explain WHY you can accomplish the same results in many different ways! The POWER of this radio lies in this system right here! This system has all the power of a 14MZ if you understand how to use it!

Video Link ->F-Mode Menus Part 1 - Menus 01-04 (55 Megs)

Video Link ->F-Mode Menus Part 2 - Throttle Curves (53 Megs)

Video Link ->F-Mode Menus Part 3 - Setting up a Throttle Hold (40 Megs)

OK the final set of videos. I will admit after reviewing them that I made a few "small" verbal mistakes but in general these should be spot on.
Video Link ->F-Mode Menus Part 4 menus 06-09, Pitch Curves, Throttle cut, Hover pitch and throttle trims (55 Megs)

Video Link ->F-Mode Menus Part 5 menus 10-14, Offset, Channel Delay, Trim & Trim step, Trim Authority (66 Megs)

Video Link ->F-Mode Menus Part 6 menus 15-18, Gyro and gov menus, Mixing, C-Mix (55 Megs)

Video Link ->F-Mode Menus Part 7 menus 19-22, VR Assignment, F-mode copy, F-Mode Delay, and F-Mode name (82 Megs)

OK I am all done with the radio menu system overview. Now stay tuned as I will show in a "build video" how to fully setup a heli with this radio.

UPDATE 6-2010
Just a little video showing how to install the Stick Stops and a little show and tell about the 6 channel 92224 RX I got.
Video Link ->Installing Stick Stops and the 6 Channel RX look-see (109 Megs)



I hope you enjoy these!
Bob
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Last edited by Finless; 06-22-2010 at 08:21 PM..
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Old 10-07-2009, 10:29 PM   #2
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Good news Bob, but with the new era of bind and fly and also mini vbar and others that are about to hit the market, these are geared toward the spektrum/jr will this radio be able to compete on that level?

Thanks

Robert
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Old 10-07-2009, 10:37 PM   #3
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Hobby People will have their own bind and fly for the ATX radios. I'm not sure how wise it is to integrate a V-Bar with a RX.

TM
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Old 10-07-2009, 11:37 PM   #4
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Finless,

Don't know if you are aware but the Main Screen, Top Level Menu Structure ... vid is not loading. I know that you are working on the vids just wanted to let you know.

My sincere appreciation for ALL your video's. As a newbie, I have watched and been educated by your great vids. Thank you and please keep them comming.

Just felt like I needed to give you props,

B
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Old 10-08-2009, 12:31 AM   #5
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Sweet, I have been flying this radio since June 15, and I love it. Very fast, very easy to setup, very sophisticated yet simple to understand programming options, and the link is rock solid. Finless I am almost certain you are going to like it a lot more once you actually fly it, it has a very nice precise feeling, very connected to your heli.

Hope you like it as much as I do, it's a great radio, and it will be nice to see other people fly it, I am the only AT guy at either place I fly.
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Old 10-08-2009, 12:48 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bmrlvigil View Post
Finless,

Don't know if you are aware but the Main Screen, Top Level Menu Structure ... vid is not loading. I know that you are working on the vids just wanted to let you know.

My sincere appreciation for ALL your video's. As a newbie, I have watched and been educated by your great vids. Thank you and please keep them comming.

Just felt like I needed to give you props,

B
Sorry link typo!

Video link is now fixed!

Bob
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Old 10-08-2009, 02:25 AM   #7
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Thank You
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Old 10-08-2009, 02:36 PM   #8
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Finless, enjoying the videos so far.

one thing you could point out relating to link number, is that you can copy a model setup to a 2nd model memory, and you can experiment with different setups without having to rebind every time you change model memory.

rock on, amirite?
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Old 10-08-2009, 06:06 PM   #9
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Cool! I had not thought of that! I will cover that wonderful idea in the copy model menu.

Thanks for the tip!

Bob
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Old 10-08-2009, 09:12 PM   #10
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subscribed....
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Old 10-13-2009, 12:03 PM   #11
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Wait until you actually fly this radio. You will come to appreciate its advantages, and I assure you that you will feel more connected and secure. This radio feels way, way, way fast in flight.

One thing I really like about this radio is the option of assigning the spring loaded switch to the "up/down" function for programming. This duplicates the "+/-" programming buttons on the face of the radio that are used to change values for any selected function.

For example, if center servos you use "+/-". If you want to increase or reduce gyro gain you would use "+/-".

Now, lets say you want to get rid of some gyro oscillation. Enter the gyro menu, select the gain value. Next, start your flight. While flying around you can bump that switch to increase or decrease your gyro gain value while in flight. You no longer have to land to make adjustments. Add gain until the tail wags, then bump the gain down one click at a time until it disappears. Ta-da! Gain set in flight without looking at the radio!!

If you wish to set your governor, have a buddy use and optical tach while you bump the switch up or down to adjust your governor values. Your buddy will tell you when you hit the target rpm, all in real time!!

You can choose anything in the menu to adjust in flight. Just highlight that value in the menu and the switch will adjust it. Of course you can disable that feature once everything is programmed to your liking.

Of course I learned of this trick from Terry Moore

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Old 10-13-2009, 12:42 PM   #12
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That's pretty cool!
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Old 10-13-2009, 01:20 PM   #13
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Yea Terry Moore showed me that trick at the Lexington Funfly and yes that was neat!

However I do wish the switches were movable as for me that switch is my idle up switch that I am use to. The back switch is a long reach even for my large hands. I guess I will get use to it.

Bob
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Old 10-13-2009, 08:15 PM   #14
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Like I said Bob, Minh will move the switches for you or you can do it. ATX do it all the time. Since we don't have labels to worry about the radio will let you do anything you want with the switches.

TM
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Old 10-13-2009, 11:06 PM   #15
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Here are the latency numbers:

Airtronics SD-10G:


Min: 7.36ms
Max: 16.3ms
Ave: 11.83ms

Futaba 10C (Futaba is a Trademark of Futaba Corporation and Dist by Great Planes):

Min: 9ms
Max: 29ms
Ave: 19ms

JR 9303 & R1221rx (JR is a Trademark of JR Radios Japan and Dist by Horizon Hobby)

Min: 25ms
Max: 47ms
Ave: 36ms

JR 12X

Min: 21.5ms
Max: 43.5ms
Ave: 32.5ms
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Old 10-14-2009, 01:27 AM   #16
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HOLY CRAP! If those numbers are real this is going to be one FAST radio!

MAN I got lots of video to shoot so it will be like a month before I get to fly it but man... I cant wait to try it!

Bob
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Old 10-14-2009, 03:49 AM   #17
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comparing those numbers to JKos numbers, it looks like the min value given is the average of MLF and MLF (min latency to first change, min latency to last change), and the maxs are averages of MaxLF and MaxLL.

so there is agreement, since ATX is probably testing for a single channel whereas JKos was testing with the changes propagated to all 3 eCCPM swash channels, hence the spread and need for a first and last change delineation.

just to be fair to futaba, their numbers for the 10C and R6008HS are, if averaging LF/LL values, would be:
min: 8.5ms
max: 15.2ms
ave: 11.7ms

mind you, futaba is doing this on 6 of the 8 channels on the R6008HS, and ATX says they're doing it on all 10 of their channels (a claim I have no reason to doubt).

there are some details of implementation that make the futaba 6 channel limitation a potential asset, and the sd-10g running all 10 outputs so fast a potential liability, but it should still be quite clearly credited that ATX is just as fast on 10 channels as futaba is doing on 6(with 2 more at normal speed), with their special fancy-pancy High Speed receiver.

the thing I'll be most interested to find is the latency of the SD-10G when used with an FHSS-1 receiver, a best possible outcome on that front would be for the radio to ride the edge of the analog servo performance envelope, like the 10C on non-HS mode and the DX7SE, which are both faster than legacy systems but not so fast that they overwhelm analog hardware. that's a sweet spot for compatibility reasons, and the availability of the ultra-fast is a great option for the ultra-dedicated. =)

(that got long fast, heh!)
-Danny
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Old 10-14-2009, 07:22 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DannyZRC View Post
comparing those numbers to JKos numbers, it looks like the min value given is the average of MLF and MLF (min latency to first change, min latency to last change), and the maxs are averages of MaxLF and MaxLL.

so there is agreement, since ATX is probably testing for a single channel whereas JKos was testing with the changes propagated to all 3 eCCPM swash channels, hence the spread and need for a first and last change delineation.

just to be fair to futaba, their numbers for the 10C and R6008HS are, if averaging LF/LL values, would be:
min: 8.5ms
max: 15.2ms
ave: 11.7ms

mind you, futaba is doing this on 6 of the 8 channels on the R6008HS, and ATX says they're doing it on all 10 of their channels (a claim I have no reason to doubt).

there are some details of implementation that make the futaba 6 channel limitation a potential asset, and the sd-10g running all 10 outputs so fast a potential liability, but it should still be quite clearly credited that ATX is just as fast on 10 channels as futaba is doing on 6(with 2 more at normal speed), with their special fancy-pancy High Speed receiver.

the thing I'll be most interested to find is the latency of the SD-10G when used with an FHSS-1 receiver, a best possible outcome on that front would be for the radio to ride the edge of the analog servo performance envelope, like the 10C on non-HS mode and the DX7SE, which are both faster than legacy systems but not so fast that they overwhelm analog hardware. that's a sweet spot for compatibility reasons, and the availability of the ultra-fast is a great option for the ultra-dedicated. =)

(that got long fast, heh!)
-Danny
The latency with FHS-1 mode is already listed on JKos' RR thread. The RDS8000 and the SD10G are the same.

The reason the numbers correlate is because the testing methodology is the one that JKos uses.

TM
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Old 10-14-2009, 11:13 PM   #19
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TMoore, the RDS8000 is encoding PPM and then transferring that to an RF deck where the A->D conversion is done.

I'm assuming the firmware inside the RDS8000 has that pulsetrain sped up quite a bit, to produce the nice low latency that they're getting.

but the SD-10G is doing FHSS-3 digitally (right?), and I would assume that they're also processing the FHSS-1 signal that way.

so, unless the timing is critical for the receiver to properly understand the signal, I wouldn't see a reason to assume the transmission would behave identically.

also, haven't seen any claims one way or another about the sd-10g on fhss-1, other than you're just now terry.

<3
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Old 10-15-2009, 08:03 AM   #20
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Question on binding. I am running the 7 channel rx, and have noticed the blue bind light on the Rx, will flash once in awhile (sitting on the bench with the Tx at normal power). When doing a range check at low power, I have notice that I can get the light to flicker alot, and even go out. Is that normal?

Bob
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