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Old 12-02-2010, 01:52 PM   #1
Ivor Hill
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Default Flymentor wireing and setting up useing Helibal Trex and clones

Set Tx swash type to 1 servo, aileron,elevator subtrims and trims to 0, end point to 100% and servo reverses to normal,exept the throttle channel leave that at it is. Set a linear pitch curve 0-25-50-75-100.
The plug with 3 wires from the FM module connects to the aileron porton the reciever, Yellow connects to elevator port, orange connects to pitch port. if you are useing the FM tail gyro the grey wire connects to the rudder port and the green connects to the gyro gain port.

If you are useing a seperate gyro leave it connected as it is and leave the grey and green wires disconnected.
The blue wire controls stabilization gain and is best left disconnected dueing set up.
If the elevator servo is rear mounted, looking at the heli from the rear the left hand servo connects to port 1 on FM,right hand servo to port 2 and elevator to port 3. The black negative wire on the servo leads are closest to the usb port and line up with the usb sign.
If the elevator servo is front mounted the it's left servo to port 2 and right servo to port 1. Leave the blue wire from the FM gyro disconnected for now. If you are useing he FM tail gyro connect tail servo to port 5 on FM.

Disconnect motor, power up TX and Heli, Led on FM should be flashing green, and connect to Helibal programme.
Check that swash type,blade direction and gyro camera directions are set correctley under the Helibal mounting tab.
Tip the heli and under the servo tab set the servo directions and send to FM so that when the heli is tipped the swash moves in the opposit direction to correct.
If you can get aileron to operate ok but not elevator the swop servo connections on FM ports 1 and 2 and start again.
Check stick directions and any that are incorrect reverse under the control tab and send to FM.
The next step is to re-level and centre the swash. First go to advance page and set balancer gain to 0 this will switch FM off and set stick midway 50%. Looking at the heli from the side use the elevator neutral slider under the servo tab to level the swash, looking at the heli from the front use aileron slider to level the swash. Then use pitch slider to set servo arms at 90 degrees. You will not get all servo at exactly at 90 degrees just get them as close as possible.
Now fit a pitch gauge and under the control tab use pitch slider to set pitch range.
Set balancer gain back to + 70.

Because the blue wire is disconnected FM gain it controlled by Helibal, I recommend you test fly and adjust the gain in Helibal for your first flights before connecting the blue wire and attempting to control gain with your TX, unless you are 100% shure you know what you are doing.
With the heli in position mode ( green light ) if the heli rocks side to side and fore and aft ( dancing ) in a hover reduce the gain just enough to stop it.
If the heli is not dancing increase the gain untill it does and then reduce just enough to stop it. Just like setting the gain on a tail gyro.
You may also need to use a little TX trim to stop the heli drifting.

If you are useing the FM tail gyro you will first need to switch it to normal mode with a gain value of about 25, either with your TX if the green wire is connected or by useing the slider on the tail page in Helibal if the green wire is disconnected.
Once in normal mode the tail servo will move to centre, set he tail slider so that it is a little off centre towards the boom. Test fly and slide the servo along the boom untill the heli will hover without stick input or trim.
Set the travel so that the tail slider does not bottom out,switch back to HH and set the best gain. You may need to use a little TX trim for best performance.
Note, when you switch to HH the tail servo will drift to one end, this is normal and it will sort itself out when you lift off into a hover, help it a little with the rudder stick.
Note, If the blue wire is connected stabilization gain is controled and adjusted in the TX and adjusting it in Helibal will have no effect, if it is disconnected stabilization gain is adjusted in Helibal.
The green wire for gyro gain works in the same way. Connected,controlled by TX disconnected controlled in Helibal.

Last edited by Ivor Hill; 12-15-2010 at 05:19 PM.. Reason: change thread name
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Old 12-02-2010, 02:14 PM   #2
Bug Splat
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Thanks Ivor!

I thought that might be the case for me but did not try it. I'll switch 1 and 2 tonight and see if that fixes my issue.
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Old 12-02-2010, 02:26 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bug Splat View Post
Thanks Ivor!

I thought that might be the case for me but did not try it. I'll switch 1 and 2 tonight and see if that fixes my issue.
I suggest you re-set Helibal to factory settings,set your Tx as instructed, disconnect the blue wire and follow the intructions.
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Old 12-02-2010, 03:02 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivor Hill View Post
Set Tx swash type to 1 servo, aileron,elevator subtrims and trims to 0, end point to 100% and servo reverses to normal.
If the elevator servo is rear mounted, looking at the heli from the rear the left hand servo connects to port 1 on FM,right hand servo to port 2 and elevator to port 3.
If the elevator servo is front mounted the it's left servo to port 2 and right servo to port 1. Leave the blue wire from the FM gyro disconnected for now.
Disconnect motor, power up TX and Heli and connect to Helibal programme.
Check that swash type,blade direction and gyro camera directions are set correctley under the Helibal mounting tab.
Tip the heli and under the servo tab set the servo directions and send to FM so that when the heli is tipped the swash moves in the opposit direction to correct.
If you can get aileron to operate ok but not elevator the swop servo connections on FM ports 1 and 2 and start again.
Check stick directions and any that are incorrect reverse under the control tab and send to FM.
The next step is to re-level and centre the swash. Looking at the heli from the side use the elevator neutral slider under the servo tab to level the swash, looking at the heli from the front use aileron slider to level the swash. Then use pitch slider to set servo arms at 90 degrees. You will not get all servo at exactly at 90 degrees just get them as close as possible.
Just a note here when you get "as close as possible to 90" and you can get very close (if not dead on it... you should not worry about the swash level until to do after you get the arms all at 90 now adjust your linkages per finless bobs ccpm video where mixing arms are level and you have 0 pitch in the middle of your swashes travel range. Also after you have verified it corrects the swash the right way and the controls move with the stick the right way you need to be sure you set fm to off (solid red LED)for all of the 90 and leveling steps.
A handy tip someone told me was to set my throttle hold pitch curve to 0, 50, 50, 50, 100 so it was easy the nail mid stick and didnt encourage cheating(ie the stick at close to 9/16 or 7/16 for 0 pitch...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivor Hill View Post
Now fita pitch gauge and under the control tab use pitch slider to set pitch range.
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Old 12-02-2010, 03:54 PM   #5
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Thanks TJ I have edited. The swash set up should have been set mechanically before before fitting FM and after fitting FM you are able to get it allmost back to that position useing neutral sliders. But since there are no seperate subtrims for each servo you must move the sliders a little more to level the swash. This will mean that the servo arms are not exacly 90 degrees but should be close.
You can leave the sliders at 0 and adjust the servo arms and links to get the swash closer to correct and then use the sliders to fine tune, most HC users do this but I have never found it necessary I just use the neutrals.
It is also possible to re-level the swash at min and max pitch to reduce servo interactions by useing TX end points.

Last edited by Ivor Hill; 12-02-2010 at 06:10 PM..
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Old 12-03-2010, 10:57 AM   #6
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Yes, it should be noted that, without individual servo subtrim on the FM, you will never get the servo arms as straight and level as you normally would without using FM. I set up an extra model in my Tx, set it up with CCPM, used the subtrims to get the swash level and the arms straight. Then I switched it over to the FM model with 1S swash, and programmed the FM. When I did that, the swash was no longer level, I had to move the sliders in the FM. It's close, but it's not perfect.
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Old 12-03-2010, 01:58 PM   #7
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I ended up setting the trim to 90* using the TX. It was freaking impossible to get it level using FM. I got it as close as I could with FM then used the TX to get it exact. Is that ok?
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Old 12-23-2010, 04:25 PM   #8
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Default FM

For some reason I cannot edit the original post. I wanted to add that I use Align PU Gell and velcro strap to mount the gyro. I have found it quite good for isolating against vibrations but does not hold the gyro very well,hence the velcro strap that is supplied with the gell.
To test that FM is not being effected by vibration. Power up in position mode with gain at factory preset +70, tip heli and check that the swash is reacting correctly, moving in the opposit direction to correct the tip.
Pin the heli down so it cannot take off and run it up to speed. The blades and flybar should remain level, if they tip then you have to much vibration and flying the heli will result in a crash.
Dont forget to save your cfg file after you have set up FM.

Last edited by Ivor Hill; 12-31-2010 at 12:46 PM..
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Old 12-23-2010, 06:43 PM   #9
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Funny, I tried many and came to the same conclusion. The only way I could get it to work perfectly on a 600.
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Old 12-25-2010, 11:39 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivor Hill View Post
For some reason I cannot edit the original post. I wanted to add that I use Align PU Gell and velcro strap to mount the gyro. I have found it quite good for isolating against vibrations but does not hold the gyro very well,hence the velcro strap that is supplied with the gell.
Ivor,
FYI, there is a time limit to edit a post..I believe its 14 days then the post can no longer be edited..but you can ask HF support if they can insert the addition for you
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Old 12-26-2010, 08:43 AM   #11
Ivor Hill
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nightflyr View Post
Ivor,
FYI, there is a time limit to edit a post..I believe its 14 days then the post can no longer be edited..but you can ask HF support if they can insert the addition for you
Thanks Rich, I did contact them because I wanted to edit,also asked if they would make it a sticky so that it would stay at the top. I think it would save some guys a lot of reading and me a lot of writing. I did not get a responce ?.
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Old 01-02-2011, 05:45 PM   #12
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Default Basic FlyMentor setup By Ivor Hill

Please read though this first before asking hardware setup questions....

This should solve most of the installation issues associated with the KDS FlyMentor System
..


Any issues concerning software installation on a PC or radio system being used should be brought up on the main Forum to be answered

Set Tx swash type to 1 servo, or H1
Aileron,Elevator trims and subtrims to 0,
End point to 100% and servo reverses to normal, except the throttle channel leave that at it is.
Set a linear pitch curve 0-25-50-75-100.
The plug with 3 wires from the FM module connects to the aileron portion the Rx
Yellow connects to Elevator port,
Orange connects to pitch port.
If you are using the FM tail gyro
Gray wire connects to the rudder port,
Green connects to the gyro gain port.

If you are using a separate tail gyro leave it connected as it is to the Rx,
and leave the gray and green wires disconnected.


The blue wire controls stabilization gain and is best left disconnected during set up.

If the elevator servo is rear mounted, looking at the helicopter from the rear .
The left hand servo connects to port 1 on FM,right hand servo to port 2 and elevator to port 3.
The black negative wire on the servo leads are closest to the USB port and line up with the USB sign.

If the elevator servo is front mounted,
The left servo to port 2 and right servo to port 1.
Leave the blue wire from the FM gyro disconnected for now.
If you are using the FM tail gyro connect tail servo to port 5 on FM.

Disconnect motor, power up TX and Helicopter,
LED on FM should be flashing green, and connect to Helibal Program

Check that swash type,blade direction and gyro camera directions are set correctly under the Helibal mounting tab.

Tip the helicopter and under the servo tab set the servo directions and send to FM so that when the helicopter is tipped, the swash moves to correct in the opposite direction.

If you can get aileron to operate, but not elevator the swap servo connections on FM ports 1 and 2 and start again.

Check stick directions and any that are incorrect reverse under the control tab and send to FM.
The next step is to re-level and center the swash.

First go to advance page and set balancer gain to 0 this will switch FM off and set stick midway 50%.
Looking at the heli from the side use the elevator neutral slider under the servo tab to level the swash, looking at the helicopter from the front use aileron slider to level the swash.
Then use pitch slider to set servo arms at 90 degrees. You will not get all servo at exactly at 90 degrees just get them as close as possible.
Now fit a pitch gauge and under the control tab use pitch slider to set pitch range.
Set balancer gain back to + 70.

Because the blue wire is disconnected, The FM gain it controlled by Helibal.

I recommend you test fly and adjust the gain in Helibal for your first flights before connecting the blue wire and attempting to control gain with your TX,
Unless you are 100% sure you know what you are doing.

With the helicopter in position mode ( green light ) if the helicopter rocks side to side and fore and aft ( dancing ) in a hover reduce the gain just enough to stop it.

If the helicopter is not dancing increase the gain until it does and then reduce just enough to stop it.
Just like setting the gain on a tail gyro.
You may also need to use a little TX trim to stop the helicopter drifting.

If you are using the FM tail gyro,
You will first need to switch it to normal mode with a gain value of about 25, either with your TX if the green wire is connected or by using the slider on the tail page in Helibal
if the green wire is disconnected.

Once in normal mode the tail servo will move to center, set the tail slider so that it is a little off center ( this is to counter the rotor torque)
Test fly and slide the servo along the boom until the helicopter will hover without stick input or trim. ( RATE MODE )
Set the travel so that the tail slider and servo do not bind or buzz .
switch back to HH and set the best gain.
You may need to use a little TX trim for best performance.
Note, when you switch to HH the tail servo will drift to one end, this is normal and it will sort itself out when you lift off into a hover, help it a little with the rudder stick.
Note, If the blue wire is connected stabilization gain is controlled and adjusted in the TX and adjusting it in Helibal will have no effect, if it is disconnected stabilization gain is adjusted in Helibal.
The green wire for gyro gain works in the same way. Connected,controlled by TX disconnected controlled in Helibal.

I wanted to add that I use Align PU Gel and velcro strap to mount the gyro. I have found it quite good for isolating against vibrations but does not hold the gyro very well,hence the velcro strap that is supplied with the gell.
To test that FM is not being effected by vibration. Power up in position mode with gain at factory preset +70, tip heli and check that the swash is reacting correctly, moving in the opposite direction to correct the tip.
Pin the heli down so it cannot take off and run it up to speed. The blades and flybar should remain level,
if they tip then you have to much vibration and flying the helicopter will result in a crash.
Do not forget to save your cfg file after you have set up FM.


Just a note here when you get "as close as possible to 90" and you can get very close (if not dead on it... you should not worry about the swash level until to do after you get the arms all at 90 now adjust your linkages per finless bobs ccpm video where mixing arms are level and you have 0 pitch in the middle of your swashes travel range. Also after you have verified it corrects the swash the right way and the controls move with the stick the right way you need to be sure you set fm to off (solid red LED)for all of the 90 and leveling steps.
A handy tip someone told me was to set my throttle hold pitch curve to 0, 50, 50, 50, 100 so it was easy the nail mid stick and didnt encourage cheating(ie the stick at close to 9/16 or 7/16 for 0 pitch...
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Last edited by nightflyr; 01-03-2011 at 03:25 AM..
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Old 01-02-2011, 05:55 PM   #13
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This should be posted in its own thread and added to be a sticky
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Old 01-02-2011, 06:00 PM   #14
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working on it..give me a minute
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Old 01-02-2011, 06:37 PM   #15
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So you don't have to worry about setting the swash at high and low for level or would FM control the leveling of the swash at high and low, been playing around and trying to get the swash level and having no luck using endpoint adjustments in the tx.
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Old 01-02-2011, 06:47 PM   #16
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With FM, TX endpoint will not work the way you think. If you can't achieve a level swash at min, mid & max then either do just mid or at +5 degrees and let it be. The bird will fly ok. There is no auto swash levelling function on FM, you just have to find a point where the swash level is satisfactory throughout.
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Old 01-02-2011, 06:51 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by Truker View Post
So you don't have to worry about setting the swash at high and low for level or would FM control the leveling of the swash at high and low, been playing around and trying to get the swash level and having no luck using endpoint adjustments in the tx.
Just get it level at zero pitch it will be fine, I have managed to do it at min and max pitch but it took hours and the heli did not fly any better.
When your flying you will not notice the bit of drifting you get cause by servo interactions, you only notice it in a hoverand when you first test fly you will be useing your TX trims to achieve the best hover.
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Old 01-02-2011, 07:00 PM   #18
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Stuck
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Old 01-02-2011, 07:07 PM   #19
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Thank you Rick!!
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Old 01-02-2011, 07:51 PM   #20
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Thanks, just killing time till it gets warmer, fly's okay already was just playing around and thought I'd give it a try.
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