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Old 04-18-2011, 06:33 PM   #21
smaze17
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Default KDE Tail Upgrade

So I just ordered the KDE tail upgrade AND the plastic tail grips for the 600n. I think using both together should provide a very reliable combination for my 700e

-Spence
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Old 04-18-2011, 11:24 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by smaze17 View Post
So I just ordered the KDE tail upgrade AND the plastic tail grips for the 600n. I think using both together should provide a very reliable combination for my 700e

-Spence
IMO that $$$ would have been better spent on the complete Quick UK tail assembly. -$50
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Old 04-18-2011, 11:33 PM   #23
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IMO that $$$ would have been better spent on the complete Quick UK tail assembly. -$50
I would say that is debatable. I have a quick uk tail sitting on my bench and the plastic grips on my heli. I thnk the Quick UK is a very nice tail but the hub is not as robust as the align hub and mine develped play between the hub and shaft. Probably a result of running 115mm blades and a couple hundred or so flights.

Will see how the plastic holds up over the next couple months...
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Old 04-19-2011, 12:48 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by In_to_the_Mystic_2003 View Post
I would say that is debatable. I have a quick uk tail sitting on my bench and the plastic grips on my heli. I thnk the Quick UK is a very nice tail but the hub is not as robust as the align hub and mine develped play between the hub and shaft. Probably a result of running 115mm blades and a couple hundred or so flights.

Will see how the plastic holds up over the next couple months...
Agree. IMHO the plastic grips are actually smoother and more robust than the Quick UK tail. Don't get me wrong, the Q UK tail is very nice but I like how solid the plastic grips feel. Even better when used with the KDE tail upgrade bearings and 12.9 bolts for the spindle.

-S
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Old 04-20-2011, 09:31 AM   #25
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Agreed, its debatable.
The plastic grips have to be more robust, they are plastic. - You also lose a radial bearing with the Align setup vs 3 total per side on the Quick tail, but as always to each his own. I tried the plastic before and much prefer the aluminum Quick UK set.
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Old 04-20-2011, 09:52 AM   #26
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Yes you do lose a radial bearing and the Quick UK is a good design except for the hub. If someone came out with a beefier hub, I would switch.
Might try the Kasama Tail, It's even better as far as slop free, but it might make the tail twitchy, will see.

I have a theory that the plastic tail is less twitchy as the flex actually helps dampen, but I dont know how to prove that...

It's all just choices, I just would not run the stock metal tail with no mods.
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Old 04-20-2011, 01:50 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by In_to_the_Mystic_2003 View Post
Yes you do lose a radial bearing and the Quick UK is a good design except for the hub. If someone came out with a beefier hub, I would switch.
Might try the Kasama Tail, It's even better as far as slop free, but it might make the tail twitchy, will see.

I have a theory that the plastic tail is less twitchy as the flex actually helps dampen, but I dont know how to prove that...

It's all just choices, I just would not run the stock metal tail with no mods.
Was thinking about running just the KDE upgrade only with the stock metal grips.

The KDE spindle bolts are a big improvement over the stock ones

Here are a few photos of the KDE upgrade with the stock grips. I can tell you guys it is now very robust with zero slop.

-S
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Old 04-21-2011, 09:25 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by In_to_the_Mystic_2003 View Post
13. Wiring
a. There are many ways to power the bird and not going to get into all that.
http://helifreak.com/showthread.php?t=237931
http://helifreak.com/showthread.php?...ghlight=wiring


the second link is broken it should be

http://helifreak.com/showthread.php ?t=223365&highlight=wiring

except without the space before the ?, for some reason it cut it off.
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Old 04-21-2011, 06:44 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by smaze17 View Post
Was thinking about running just the KDE upgrade only with the stock metal grips.

The KDE spindle bolts are a big improvement over the stock ones

Here are a few photos of the KDE upgrade with the stock grips. I can tell you guys it is now very robust with zero slop.
-S
Spool it up on the bench with main blades removed and tail pitch arm disconnected.
If you feel the boom you will have a significant amount of vibration which is not good.
1. Lose the Edge Tail Blades
2. Rotortech 115 or 120 will be a lot smoother.
The first tail I ran was the stock with KDE Upgrade, but could never get it smooth.
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Old 04-21-2011, 07:13 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by In_to_the_Mystic_2003 View Post
Spool it up on the bench with main blades removed and tail pitch arm disconnected.
If you feel the boom you will have a significant amount of vibration which is not good.
1. Lose the Edge Tail Blades
2. Rotortech 115 or 120 will be a lot smoother.
The first tail I ran was the stock with KDE Upgrade, but could never get it smooth.
Will do bro - thanks for the great advice

How about running the stock 105's that come with the kit?

-Spence
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Old 04-21-2011, 07:36 PM   #31
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My humble opinion is the align 105 tails are very good blades. Edge tail blades from my experience, cause vibrations increasingly proportional to the size your running.
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Old 04-21-2011, 07:38 PM   #32
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Will do bro - thanks for the great advice

How about running the stock 105's that come with the kit?

-Spence
Stock 105's are smoother, you will be able to blow them out if you pound it hard.
Hence 115's...
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Old 04-21-2011, 07:44 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by In_to_the_Mystic_2003 View Post
Stock 105's are smoother, you will be able to blow them out if you pound it hard.
Hence 115's...
OK....think I will try the 105's for now. I'm currently doing just mild 3D so it should be all good in the hood

I did notice that the KDE tail upgrade did require some "fiddling" with to get it to move smoothly. As in_to_the_mystic stated at the beginning of this wonderful thread (thanks brother), there was considerable binding of the tail control links after assembly. However, I simply loosened the cap screws and re-tightened them and it's buttery smooth now. I think the most important part of the upgrade is the M3x12 button head screws used as the spindle bolts. These are 4 mm longer than the stock screws and they are 12.9 alloy which apparently the stock screws are not.

-S
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Old 05-10-2011, 06:10 AM   #34
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Thanks In_to_the_Mystic_2003 for this great accumulation of info.

I've got my kit coming and should be here tomorrow and I've spent quite a bit of time on this section planning out all the mods needed, but in reading this thread I see there are more I didn't even know about so thanks so much.

Btw just to mention one thing in the the link for the place to purchase the MD600 110T Herringbone Gear doesn't seem to be linking well.

For me I got mine on order from RCE Hobby: http://rcehobby.com/product_info.php?products_id=1833

With a matching 12T: http://rcehobby.com/product_info.php?products_id=1934

Am also planning to use it on the CHP RES frame set so I wonder if I might have to do the trimming?

Guess I will find out.

Thanks again for all the info.
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Old 05-10-2011, 07:39 AM   #35
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Originally Posted by WBFAir View Post
Thanks In_to_the_Mystic_2003 for this great accumulation of info.

I've got my kit coming and should be here tomorrow and I've spent quite a bit of time on this section planning out all the mods needed, but in reading this thread I see there are more I didn't even know about so thanks so much.

Btw just to mention one thing in the the link for the place to purchase the MD600 110T Herringbone Gear doesn't seem to be linking well.

For me I got mine on order from RCE Hobby: http://rcehobby.com/product_info.php?products_id=1833

With a matching 12T: http://rcehobby.com/product_info.php?products_id=1934

Am also planning to use it on the CHP RES frame set so I wonder if I might have to do the trimming?

Guess I will find out.

Thanks again for all the info.
Nice Frame set, Do not have one but when I break the stock ones then they are going on the bird. Not sure if they need to be modded for herringbone but let us know please.
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Old 05-10-2011, 08:05 AM   #36
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Nice Frame set, Do not have one but when I break the stock ones then they are going on the bird. Not sure if they need to be modded for herringbone but let us know please.
I'll be happy to do so In_to_the_Mystic_2003 but just to mention it, I probably will not really be doing any major building of the model as soon as I get it.

Kinda jumped the gun on the kit plan as there was kinda a price jump on the kit as a lot of things are going up these days.

Still have to get the rest of the frame upgrades, the BeastX system, the packs and new chargers and a new 8FGS, so $ wise, still have a way to go.

But I do plan the get some of the frame upgrades next in the next few weeks or so and at least do some assembling so I could at least measure something.

Again, thanks for all the help on everything.
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Old 05-29-2011, 03:48 PM   #37
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So is the KDE tail upgrade with the align metal grips and rotortech 115 blades a good smooth combo or should I get the plastic grips? I am trying to get rid of a tail vib that I have with the kde upgrade with metal grips and align 105 blades.
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Old 05-29-2011, 06:07 PM   #38
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So is the KDE tail upgrade with the align metal grips and rotortech 115 blades a good smooth combo or should I get the plastic grips? I am trying to get rid of a tail vib that I have with the kde upgrade with metal grips and align 105 blades.
That should work fine. A lot of guys are using the 600N plastic tail grips on their 700e's with great success.

I think at the absolute minimum you should get the KDE upgrade simply because it includes 12.9 alloy spindle bolts that are 4mm longer than the stock bolts which are not made from 12.9 alloy. I'm using the KDE upgrade with the stock Align 105's

S
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Old 05-29-2011, 07:30 PM   #39
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I had tail grip depart my 700 today. Align metal grips with the KDE upgrade and kbdd blades. I found half of the 12.9 bolt still in the hub where it snapped apart. The unbalance stripped the whole tail drive gear tain and resulted in a crash. So even the "upgrade" tails are still fallible.
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Old 05-29-2011, 08:54 PM   #40
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Originally Posted by flyride View Post
So is the KDE tail upgrade with the align metal grips and rotortech 115 blades a good smooth combo or should I get the plastic grips? I am trying to get rid of a tail vib that I have with the kde upgrade with metal grips and align 105 blades.
If you are getting Tail Vibes with stock blades then something else is wrong.
1. Check Tail bearings for slop
2. Check Tail Hub for play between hub and Tail shaft, Green Locktite works well here.
3. Balance the entire tail assembly on prop balancer.

I do not like the metal tail although a lot of guys seem to not have issues, the plastic is what I prefer.
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