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Old 11-14-2011, 05:06 PM   #1
bwoollia
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Default KDS 600E Innova FBL

Well, I figured it was time to upgrade from my trusty Flasher / T-Rex 500 to a larger helicopter and join the flybarless revolution. Lots of choices out there, but a new line from KDS caught my eye. I like KDS, I've flown one of their 450 series and their Flymentor works as advertised.

I of course headed to the forums to research this new heli, and of course Helifreak was the first stop. I of course found a lot of controversy - many view this helicopter as a substandard clone. Mostly speculation of course, but I had to find out for myself . In the name of stirring up some controversy, I chose the KDS 600E FBL!

I purchased the "KDS Innova 600FBL Flybarless Helicopter Super Combo" from SN Hobbies, this includes the following:

-Flybarless Helicopter
-KDS E-Bar (perhaps not a great name for something that isn't a clone)
-CF Blades
-KDS N680 digital cyclic servos
-KDS N690 digital tail servo
-KDS BL -5052-500kv motor
-KDS 120A HV ESC (the manual reads suspiciously identical to a HobbyWing Platinum ESC)
KDS 8A UBEC

The kit also included all the little extra doodads like velcro straps and loctite. The manual is very comprehensive, it reads like an Align manual and covers both the flybar and fbl versions.

The CNC machining appears very good. The frame and head come assembled, however there is a bright red sheet on top of the the box contents that warns that the helicopter has to be reassembled with loctite before flying. Overall, the fit and finish appears very good.

The canopy on the box appears blue and white, however the one that came with the helicopter is red and yellow with a black top. I prefer the red and yellow.

I'll be putting this together slowly over the next few weeks, posting photos now and again. My goal is to upgrade to a unique, flybarless 600 sized helicopter.

The Box:


WARNING!


Contents:


Nice looking canopy!


Main fuselage.


Components:


Electronics:
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Old 11-14-2011, 09:30 PM   #2
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Very nice, I'm watching this one closely. When can I get a barebones kit in the U.S.?
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Old 11-15-2011, 12:01 AM   #3
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When I got mine from SN Hobbies, they said they were getting the barebones kits in soon. Not sure how long soon is!
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Old 11-15-2011, 03:36 PM   #4
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subscribed, keep those pic coming im interested in a barebones kit also, cant wait to see a price
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Old 11-15-2011, 06:51 PM   #5
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Got a bit of work done, this project will be done in small, regular bites (hopefully). I have firmed up the fuselage somewhat and mounted the servos.

NOTE: When mounting the tail servo, the spacers each take two small and two large screws. The hole sizes are different, so if you put the wrong size screw in you might strip your spacer. The small ones hold the servo to the spacers, the large ones hold the spacers to the fuselage side.

Nice layout! When I was installing the servos with the arms and ball links installed, it looked like the balls should have been mounted on the inside of the servo arm. I checked by holding the swashplate over the whole assembly and sure enough, the manual was right!









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Old 11-15-2011, 09:19 PM   #6
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Here's a quick video I did of the box contents:

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Old 11-15-2011, 09:34 PM   #7
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Looks very similar to a Mikado.
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Old 11-15-2011, 09:40 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Agibbs996 View Post
Looks very similar to a Mikado.
Yes, there's some discussion elsewhere in the forums regarding that...
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Old 11-16-2011, 01:19 PM   #9
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Hi those are great kits. I personally fly the 600FBL Innova. and have been very impressed.
You can find Bare bone kits and Super combos at kanddrc.com
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Old 11-16-2011, 01:20 PM   #10
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Oh

Forgot to mention they are in the USA along with all parts.
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Old 11-16-2011, 02:01 PM   #11
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Nice to know, thanks! Have you had good luck with the servos? I've heard many rumblings about failed N680 cyclics, but no first hand accounts.
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Old 11-16-2011, 02:04 PM   #12
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Not trying to diss KDS, but why get a copy of the Mikado for the same price as a real mikado? Granted you aren't getting the CF frame set...but still..
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Old 11-16-2011, 02:56 PM   #13
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It's new, it's different, and I've had good experience with KDS. It's not a clone, however there are many visual similarities. Much the same can be said for most other helicopters - there's not a whole lot of innovation in R/C helis (perhaps SAB can be applauded for their recent introduction of the Goblin).

Mostly, my favourite hobby shop started to carry it and I'd been admiring it from afar. I know parts will be available from I guy I know and trust.
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Old 11-16-2011, 10:16 PM   #14
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Replacement parts seem very reasonably priced right? The main grips cost less than my 500.
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Old 11-16-2011, 10:31 PM   #15
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No problems with the N680's yet, knock on wood.
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Old 11-16-2011, 10:35 PM   #16
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I managed to get a bit more work done today. First I installed the tail rotor assembly to the boom, threading the belt into the boom. Most of the bolts are held in place with locknuts, maybe three or four bolts need loctite. I then proceeded to install the belt / main gear / main shaft.

What a pain.

It's a nice setup, but a bit of a puzzle. First, get the shaft through the top two bearings and through the tail belt gear and washer (you'll drop that washer about fifty times). Make sure you orient the belt correctly (with no twists, the tail rotor should be pointed at the floor). Then slide in the main gear with its washer in place. These should all be kind of loose now. Next, take the main shaft lower sleeve and work that onto the shaft, making sure you leave space between the two gears to put in the little locking pin that keeps the belt gear rotating with the main shaft. This has to go through the sleeve AND shaft, then the shaft and pin slides into place on the belt gear. Finally, put the lower shaft spacer on the shaft below the main gear, and install the lower main shaft bearing and holder. Whew. Now go wash the oil off your hands and lie down for a bit.

I've attached some pictures from the manual for the process.

The fit of these parts is excellent - everything fits together perfectly with no slop.








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Old 11-18-2011, 02:16 PM   #17
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here are some images from my Galley on a different form of the Innova 700

http://rc.runryder.com/helicopter/gallery/85205/
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Old 11-19-2011, 01:35 PM   #18
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Progress continues. The head is together, more or less. I need to disassemble and reassemble the blade grip and feathering shaft, other than that it's done. It's surprising how little needs to be done on a flybarless head - the intricate mechanical fiddlings of the flybar are all gone! It would be tough to miss anything here that would cause an interaction, and even if I did the 3-axis unit would probably cover it up.

As you can see, the head is quite tall. Apparently there will be a new headblock available for this model soon - this one was designed for the flybarred version as you can see from the holes for the flybar through it. A shorter headblock with new pitchlinks will bring the rotor disc closer to the helicopter's CG.

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Old 12-03-2011, 03:13 PM   #19
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IT FLIES!

Man, I was one nervous cat. Lots of double checking the setup last night. I flew it on the "Vivid" agility mode, 80 bar gain (default). I had set up some dual rates set up around 75%, but I forgot to enable them. Dual rates are for wimps anyways. 20% expo on the cyclic, nothing on the rudder, but I smoothed out my pitch curve to 100 - 30 - 50 - 70 - 100 to calm things down in the hover.

I started up in "normal" mode to make sure the super-soft start was working, it was so I'll never use normal mode again. I didn't even have to reverse the phase of any motor wires! It was going to be a good flight, I could tell.

I switched into idle-up 2 (100 - 90 - 100) and let that sucker spool up. No vibes, the tail held, and the blades tracked right away. No excuse not to fly.

Up into the hover - the tail held, although there is a very slight wag (hunt?) that I accepted. I'll try upping the gain (65%) and see where that goes later.

Then I was off! A quick circuit, some tic-tocs to get the feel of her then a nice gentle funnel. A big, lazy loop, some more tic-tocs then back for a landing - my hands were getting cold (it's probably -5C outside now). Throttle hold at four feet for a lazy man's autorotation and it was done .

I'm very impressed. Of course, this is my first 600 so I would probably be impressed with just about anything. However, I absolutely LOVE the response of the E-Bar (my first flybarless flight ever) and the Innova 600E seems to have whole fistful of power that it's ready to dole out.

Video coming soon.
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Old 12-03-2011, 05:54 PM   #20
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Video of the maiden flight:

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