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Old 12-09-2012, 09:37 AM   #1
rccopter
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Default Need Advice - Mikado Logo

Hello,
A friend sold me an old, naked, Mikado Logo very cheap. He just wanted it out of his basement. It says Logo 400 on the canopy, but it is as large as my Gaui 550 and had 550 blades on it. I know he put a larger boom on it. Is this really a 400 canopy, and is it possible this was a 400 size originally? The frame looks much bigger than a 400 to me.

My main question is, I would like a flybarless machine. Would it make sense to start with this frame and build one? Are parts still available for this model? Would it make sense financially or should I just buy a 500 FBL??

Thanks.

Rick
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Old 12-09-2012, 10:41 AM   #2
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It is a Logo 10 with a C.F. frame. The 400 canopy does fit it. The 400 is a shrunk down Logo 10.
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Old 12-09-2012, 10:55 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rccopter View Post
Hello,
A friend sold me an old, naked, Mikado Logo very cheap. He just wanted it out of his basement. It says Logo 400 on the canopy, but it is as large as my Gaui 550 and had 550 blades on it. I know he put a larger boom on it. Is this really a 400 canopy, and is it possible this was a 400 size originally? The frame looks much bigger than a 400 to me.

My main question is, I would like a flybarless machine. Would it make sense to start with this frame and build one? Are parts still available for this model? Would it make sense financially or should I just buy a 500 FBL??

Thanks.

Rick
You could easily convert this to fbl with a head conversion from ready heli
Yes they still make parts and sell kits . It is an awesome time tested 500 class heli
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Old 12-09-2012, 12:28 PM   #4
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yeh , its really close looking to my logo 14 i have sitting here logo 10 it is.
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Old 12-09-2012, 04:03 PM   #5
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earlier this year i bought a plastic frame logo 10 and converted it to FBL. i believe you need to put the L500 fbl head on it. Flies great! After crashing, i have it at Logo 400 se size these days so ive got a shorter boom and 473mm blades. you can also run an even shorter boom and 430mm blades. its very cool that the frame is so versatile.
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Old 12-09-2012, 04:13 PM   #6
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Thank you all for your replies.
bewing2, do you by any chance have the parts list for your conversion?

Thanks.

Rick
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Old 12-09-2012, 04:43 PM   #7
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http://www.readyheli.com/MIK4041-V-B...s_p_35286.html

http://www.readyheli.com/MIK4436-Upg...E_p_38444.html
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Old 12-10-2012, 12:03 AM   #8
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You can very easily and cheaply convert the plastic head to a flybarless one with just a few parts and a little cutting.

I am currently flying a converted plastic flybar head on my stretched 400 and it flies great. I couldn't bring myself to spend a fortune on the 500 vbar head.
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Old 12-10-2012, 09:57 AM   #9
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Thanks! Would you by chance be able to send a picture or instructions for your mod?

Rick
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Old 12-11-2012, 01:52 AM   #10
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Went to a family birthday party last night and by the time I got home I had totally forgotten to take some pics of my converted plastic head. Did a little scratching though and found a pic of one that a flying buddy did years ago and originally gave me the idea to convert mine.

I'll do my best to describe the process to you here and give you a parts list.

Firstly the parts list:
1) Obviously you will need the complete existing flybar head with the grips etc...
2) MIK1916 Socket Head Cap Screw M3x22
3) MIK1574 Steel Ball With 3mm Hole
4) MIK4051 Washer For Blade Holder 12mm
5) MIK4018 Swashplate Driver For V-Bar Head 10mm Diameter
5) Optional parts:
MIK01587 Control rod 55mm
MIK1586 Control Rod 60mm
MIK1579 Control Rod 65mm


How it all goes together:
1) Remove everything from the main plastic head piece and cut the top ring part off where the flybar assembly used to fit. Sand/grind the top part nice and round so the head looks neat. You don't have to take it all off, I left about 1 mm of the old structure on the top all the way round as a reinforcing rib.

2) Attach MIK1916, MIK1574 and MIK4051 to your existing grips as you would do with a standard v-bar grip. Look at the Logo 400 V-Bar manual if this part confuses you.

3) Reassemble the head as before and make sure everything moves freely.

4) Place the swash driver on the main shaft followed by the converted head and tighten the head onto the main shaft.

5) Lastly (the fiddly bit) check which length control rod (55mm, 60mm or 65mm) will give you zero pitch when the swash plate is at mid stick and attach the plastic ball links.

6) Rest of the setup is stock v-bar setup.


Some points to ponder:
This is by no means a definitive" how to convert your plastic head" guide, please use your common sense if you are not sure about something, and double check all your parts and measurements before you place your parts order.

The v-bar main shaft for the Logo 400 is about 10mm shorter than the stock one. If you can find some of these (sorry I don't have the parts number) you can use the 55mm control rods from your existing flybar head to drive the converted plastic head and you get that nice lowered head look. I have done this and it looks really nice.

If you don't want to spend a lot of money on part MIK4018 (Swashplate Driver For V-Bar) you can use the existing washout base from the flybar head and just place a locking coller above and below it so it can't move up and down. The plus part of this is you don't have to set the phasing manually as the washout base will still connect to the head with the pins as they used to with the flybar setup and it's much cheaper. The down side is that it looks a little ugly and DIY.

And lastly to answer the inevitable question "Is the plastic head going to be strong enough", the short answer is: Yes, if it was strong enough to hold the flybar setup on your heli, it will be just as strong now.
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Old 12-11-2012, 07:17 AM   #11
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Thank you very much!

Rick
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Old 12-12-2012, 01:04 AM   #12
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Some pics of my converted plastic head
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Old 12-12-2012, 02:17 AM   #13
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Thanks a lot Bullfrog. I'm converting my Logo 10 to flybarless, and i will strictly follow your precious advice !
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Old 12-12-2012, 06:14 AM   #14
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Great, it's a fun and easy mod to do.

I had almost no flybarless experience when I did the mod and it turned out great, so if I can do it anyone can.

Been flying it like that for the last year and a half, had three major crashes (all pilot error) and the plastic head has performed flawlessly.
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Old 12-17-2012, 05:20 PM   #15
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Bullfrog,

Regarding: " If you don't want to spend a lot of money on part MIK4018 (Swashplate Driver For V-Bar) you can use the existing washout base from the flybar head and just place a locking coller above and below it so it can't move up and down...."

The v-bar swash driver's pivot points are on the opposite side of the vertical center axis as compared to the stock swashplate driver. Therefore the v-bar swashplate driver horizontal pivot arms are longer than the stock ones. Won't the up / down travel of the swash be limited using the stock swahhplate driver vs the v-bar driver?

Rick
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Old 12-18-2012, 01:00 AM   #16
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Hi Rick,

You are probably right, I must admit I didn't try that out myself as I decided to just order the v-bar driver and be done with it. That's the main reason I mentioned it in the "points to ponder" section and not in the main explanation.

I do remember reading a post somewhere of a guy that got this to work on a plastic head conversion but I cant find the post anymore . Anyway I guess if you put the locking coller low enough that the pins from the head engage but nothing at the top so it can move up if needed you could make it work.

Ultimately I agree though that it does complicate things a little (and looks ugly), better just to spend the money on the v-bar swash plate driver.
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Old 12-18-2012, 06:09 AM   #17
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Thanks Bullfrog for the quick response. I already ordered some parts this week - it's always exciting to start a new project!


Rick.
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Old 12-20-2012, 09:30 PM   #18
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Another question. The frame will only accept a micro servo, like the Futaba S9650. Even a slightly larger one won't fit. Is this an adequate servo for what will be a flybarless 500 size heli (extended tail, 550mm blades.)? The Logo 500 FBL comes with much larger servos with higher torque specs.

Thanks.

Rick
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Old 12-20-2012, 10:40 PM   #19
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The 9650's are more than adequate for the L400. The bad thing is they use nylon gears. Any crashes and you're going to take out one or more gears.

I installed metal gears in mine (when I had it). AFAIK, Futaba doesn't make any metal gears for it but MKS does. Just order the metal gear set for the MKS version of the 9650's I think the MKS version is (or was) DS9660.
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Old 12-21-2012, 12:36 AM   #20
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I'm running DS510m's in my logo 400 which has 500mm blades and they are plenty strong. I see their specs (as far as torque goes) are pretty similar to the Futaba S9650 so they should be fine.

I can tell you the DS510m servos are hard as nails. I have had some horrendous crashes where the connecting rod from the servo to the swash was bent to almost 90 degrees and the servos have always been fine. On the down side they are a little noisy and the gears have a small amount of play but none of that has ever affected my flying.
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